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Does Anyone At WUSTL Get BIGLAW?: An Empirical Study
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Date: May 10th, 2010 9:42 AM Author: pea-brained nursing home gunner I thought I'd see where the Class of 2009 landed, job-wise. Here's the results so far for the Vault 15.
Wachtell: 0 Cravath: 0 Skadden: 0 SullCrom: 0 DPW: 0 Weil: 0 STB: 1 (Palo Alto) Cleary: 0 Covington: 0 Kirkland: 3 (2 CHI, 1 NYC) W&C: 0 Debevoise: 0 Paul Weiss: 2 (NYC) GDC: 0 Sidley: 1 (NYC) VAULT 15 SUBTOTAL: 7 (2.5% of the graduating class) WilmerHale: 0 Latham: 2 (CHI, LA) A&P: 0 Jones Day: 0 White & Case: 0 Shearman: 0 OMM: 0 Quinn: 0 Ropes: 2 (Boston, NYC) Hogan Lovells: 0 VAULT 25 SUBTOTAL: 11 (4.1% of the graduating class) Clifford Chance: 0* MoFo: 0 Mayer Brown: 0 Linklaters: 0* Boies: 0 Milbank: 0 Paul Hastings: 0 Akin Gump: 1 (Houston) Fried Frank: 0 Winston: 1 (CHI) VAULT 35 SUBTOTAL: 13 (4.8% of the graduating class) Allen & Overy: 0* Willkie Farr: 0 Freshfields: 0* Baker Botts: 0 MTO: 0 Orrick: 0 Baker McKenzie: 1 (CHI) Goodwin Procter: 1 (Boston) ENJOYING DLA PIPER: 0 King & Spalding: 2 (DC) Jenner: 0* Dewey: 0 Proskauer: 2 (1 Boston, 1 LA) V&E: 0 Irell: 0 VAULT 50 SUBTOTAL: 19 (7.0% of the graduating class) Fulbright: 0 Wilson Sonsini: 0* MLB: 0 MWE: 2 (1 CHI, 1 DC) Alston & Bird: 1 (Atlanta) Bingham: 0 Fish: 0 Dechert: 0 GT: 0 Cadwalader: 1 (NYC) VAULT 60 SUBTOTAL: 23 (8.5% of the graduating class) Cooley: 1 (Palo Alto) Pillsbury: 1 (LA) Sonnenschein: 2* (1 Kansas City, 1 NYC) Cahill: 1 (NYC) Holland: 0 K&L Gates: 0 Nixon Peabody: 0* Foley: 0 Kaye Scholer: 0 Steptoe: 0 VAULT 70 SUBTOTAL: 28 (10.4% of the graduating class) Reed Smith: 1* (CHI) Bryan Cave: 4 (St. Louis) Perkins Coie: 0 Hunton: 0 Patton Boggs: 0 Arent Fox: 0* Schulte: 1 (NYC) Howrey: 0 Chadborne: 0 Crowell: 0 VAULT 80 SUBTOTAL: 34 (12.6% of the graduating class)
--- Thompson Coburn: 2 (St. Louis) Armstrong Teasdale: 1* (St. Louis) Husch: 5 (4 St. Louis, 1 Springfield) --- CLERKSHIPS COA (3): Hamilton (7th), Shepherd (8th), Ebel (10th) DCT (4): Ontero (CDCal), McDade (CDIll), Hamilton (SDInd), McCalla (WDTenn) Article I (1): Baker (Armed Forces) ST SUPREME (1): Rucker (Ind) ST LOWER (1): Hunt (WA Ct App) --- More to come! * denotes Google search of the firm site |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 10:20 AM Author: Cordovan sickened degenerate i know people are joking about it below, but i'm sure self-selection plays a not insignificant role. many people probably want to go to chicago/mineappolis/texas or stick around in missouri. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14952662) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 6:01 PM Author: Purple boyish station goddamn. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15145901) |
Date: May 10th, 2010 10:09 AM Author: Plum motley crackhouse But there's SELF SELECTION. Who on earth at WUSTL even WANTS to work a Sullcrom or WLRK? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14952611) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 10:14 AM Author: swashbuckling mischievous meetinghouse this made me laugh. Dudes at WUSTL would sell their mother's pussy just to sit in the Sullcrom lobby for an hour. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14952629) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 10:15 AM Author: Plum motley crackhouse STFU. the ONLY reason WLRK doesnt recruit at WUSTL is that they wouldnt get enough students from there. WUSTL students are just not interested in WLRK. Everyone knows this. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14952639) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 11:55 AM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter LOfuckingL (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953169) |
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Date: January 12th, 2012 1:21 PM Author: shimmering floppy theater 180!!!!!! BUMP FOR TIMELESSNESS!!! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#19768113) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 11:54 AM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953157) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:30 PM Author: magenta candlestick maker tbf, you really should limit this to the top firms in chicago/minneapolis/etc. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953471) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:31 PM Author: Plum motley crackhouse exactly.no way wustl grads want to work at DPW. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953476) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:37 PM Author: magenta candlestick maker you really think it's just coincidence that K&E has 3 wustlers? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953537) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:39 PM Author: vigorous magical orchestra pit Just because V10 NYC or DC or Westcoast firms do not choose to hire WUSTL grads, doesn't mean there aren't WUSTLers who want to work there. There are a shitload of people from the midatlantic/northeast at WUSTL. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953548) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:40 PM Author: Plum motley crackhouse pretty stupid argument. you really think that just because some grads got chicago jobs at an elite chicago firm, that means they can get new york jobs at elite new york firms but didnt want them?
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:44 PM Author: magenta candlestick maker I guess I'd want to compare WUSTL's placement to that of UMN, Illinois, and Notre Dame to see if there is a reasonable amount of self-selection or not. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953592) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:46 PM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter shouldn't the Bryan Cave numbers put a lot of this argument to rest? Let's see em. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953616) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:48 PM Author: Plum motley crackhouse dont think so. bryan cave is a sinking ship. if they have very few WUSTLers starting, could be because they couldn't take as many rather than because WUSTLers wanted to go elsewhere. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953632) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:54 PM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter Bryan Cave's St. Louis office, from the firm website
WUSTL class of '07: 3
WUSTL class of '08: 1
WUSTL class of '09: 4 |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 1:05 PM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter They actually have more WUSTLers than at any time in the last couple years. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953782) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 12:58 PM Author: Flesh Psychic Coldplay Fan i dont think anyone believes WUSTL is a national school. are you just trying to confirm what everyone already knows?
there ARE some people who think WUSTL does well in CHI, though. so it would make more sense to take chicago #s |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 1:00 PM Author: Plum motley crackhouse it's not about being a national school. it's about WUSTL trolls who believe that self-selection makes a huge difference in its placement numbers. It doesnt. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953736) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 1:15 PM Author: Mildly Autistic Rigpig Self-selection might explain why WUSTL grads work shitlaw in Missouri rather than shitlaw in Miami, but not why no one does the WUSTL at DPW, Cravath, or any of the other NY firms they list under "Employers Who Actively Recruit Washington University School of Law Students." http://law.wustl.edu/career_services/documents/employers.pdf
Also, that pdf is posted as a current link on the WUSTL Career Services page for prospective students, and includes Thelen Reid and Heller Ehrman.
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Date: May 10th, 2010 1:22 PM Author: pea-brained nursing home gunner (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953934) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 3:03 PM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter There isn't a single WUSTL alum in all of Cravath. Isn't it a stretch to put out there that Cravath "actively recruits" WUSTL students when you could simultaneously publish a list of firms that have ABSOLUTELY NO WUSTL STUDENTS and include Cravath on the same list?
Hogan appears 7 times on that list of actively recruiting firms. There is presently a single associate from WUSTL in the ENTIRE firm. She graduated 5 years ago. |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 3:07 PM Author: zippy location ceo Their list of MO employers has United States Postal Service followed by US Postal Service. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14954796) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 1:11 PM Author: pea-brained nursing home gunner Updated. This was going to be a game at first, but now it's depressing to see what my degree is worth. At least I've been out for a while and it really doesn't directly affect me. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14953834) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 1:49 PM Author: swashbuckling mischievous meetinghouse Duder there is a Cornell law grad who emailed me when I moved to DC trying to find out if I needed a real estate broker. Dude sells houses with a Cornell JD. It aint just WUSTL's fault, but the whole professions. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14954123) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 2:32 PM Author: drunken state to be fair, cornell isn't really a powerhouse either. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14954507) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 2:21 PM Author: fragrant crusty corner partner It would make more sense to work up from the bottom on the Amlaw 200. If WUSTL is going to place in biglaw, thats where people are going to go. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14954410) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 2:29 PM Author: blathering aquamarine space becky Subject: hahahaha this is truly an epic thread. kudos to you OP (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14954469) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 9:43 PM Author: hot embarrassed to the bone church A guy with the moniker "uchicagolaw" laughs at a rancid TTT law school's shitty performance, why? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14958485) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 9:48 PM Author: blathering aquamarine space becky that's hardly fair. wustl is not a rancid ttt. it's an extremely strong (yet extraordinarily region-bound) T20 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14958544) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 6:24 PM Author: pea-brained nursing home gunner Vault 50 done! So if you're in the top 6%, you can get a Vault 50 firm! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14956494) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 9:30 PM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter Subject: NY numbers http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=93259 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14958384) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 9:35 PM Author: lascivious stubborn police squad legend Subtle Fordham troll. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14958415) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 9:40 PM Author: Rambunctious Trip University Affirmative Action No Jones Day or White and Case is pretty damning. If you can't get that from WUStL, what can you get? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14958449) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 9:41 PM Author: crimson party of the first part I know a washu chick that summered at Jones Day this past summer... I don't know if she got an offer. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14958464) |
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Date: May 10th, 2010 9:52 PM Author: Appetizing Alpha holy shit; i wouldn't have been so indifferent to my lofty V-10 pedigree if i'd known it was like this (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14958599) |
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Date: May 13th, 2010 3:42 PM Author: pea-brained nursing home gunner (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#14982340) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 4:49 PM Author: Primrose Mood Plaza Not sure where you're getting your numbers, but two '09 grads summered at Cravath and received offers. Both are deferred and I know one is currently at DOJ in DC. There are also two '09 grads at Ropes in NYC.
Given the small-ish number of good students at Wash U who want to be in NYC or CA (as opposed to Chicago, St. Louis, DC and Boston), the Vault 100 representation is going to be disproportionately low. If you expand the list to NLJ 250 firms, we make a decent showing: http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/law%20schools_charts_page12.pdf |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 4:51 PM Author: lavender internet-worthy selfie den faggot (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15145496) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 4:59 PM Author: Primrose Mood Plaza pardon? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15145546) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 5:02 PM Author: vigorous magical orchestra pit V100 accounts for DC and Boston quite well, and it's not like you're sending many to Boston. The NLJ chart is accurate, though. The sad thing is that WUSTL consistently does better than all the 19-35 ranked schools, with the exception of BU, BC, GW, Fordham, ND and maybe UIUC. It is legitimately a top 25 school. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15145567) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 6:39 PM Author: Primrose Mood Plaza True for DC, but the V100 doesn't account for Boston very well. The only Boston-based firms are Ropes, Bingham and Mintz Levin (WilmerHale is no longer "based" in Boston). Several strong smaller Boston-based firms that are more selective than many on the V100 (and to which many wustl students go) are not included: Foley Hoag, Choate, Nutter McClennen, Sullivan & Worcester and Goulston & Storrs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15146222) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 6:09 PM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter why is it a given that a smallish number of WUSTL kids want DC and Boston but not NYC? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15145963) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 6:30 PM Author: Primrose Mood Plaza not sure you phrased your question correctly, but i'll try to answer it anyway.
there aren't that many students at wash u who want to work in NYC for large law firms. whether because nyc biglaw can be a hellish, soul-draining experience, because there aren't that many students from NYC and the tri-state area or just because (gasp! believe it or not!) not EVERYONE loves NYC and aspires to work there, i am not quite sure. the fact remains that the applicant pool for the NYC off-campus job fair (the best shot for NYC biglaw) is hardly composed of the strongest students in the class and is roughly the same size as the pool for the off-campus new england and DC job fairs. |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 6:11 PM Author: Aphrodisiac faggot firefighter Cravath does not count a single WUSTL alum in current ranks. But according to you they went out and snagged two of them for summer of '09? Are these the same WUSTL students who prefer Boston and DC? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15145985) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 6:34 PM Author: Primrose Mood Plaza again, your question makes little sense (despite your best efforts at sarcasm), but i'll try to answer. cravath participates in our off-campus NYC job fair and has for several years. they hired two '09 grads for summer '08 gigs. not sure why and i'm not sure anyone really cares. it's certainly not seen around school as some big accomplishment, but then again, the atmosphere at wash u is is slightly different than one where slavish devotion to the vault 100 is all that matters (like here, perhaps?) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15146182) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 6:18 PM Author: Arousing center this graph is useless; it should count people who clerk & have offers (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15146053) |
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Date: June 9th, 2010 2:26 PM Author: pea-brained nursing home gunner I really enjoyed this! A lot of WUSTL graduates have BIGLAW, they're just not listed on the firm Web sites! And DC just doesn't have any Vault 100 firms! And WUSTL places extremely well in Boston! And there are just *crowds* of students who are paying sticker at a T-19 law school *just* for the shot at one of the elite law firms in St. Louis! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15201201) |
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Date: June 9th, 2010 11:46 PM Author: Primrose Mood Plaza You're kind of an idiot. Reveal yourself, numbnuts. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15206110) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2010 5:19 PM Author: blathering aquamarine space becky wustl places about as well as cornell or gulc. htfh.
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Date: June 3rd, 2010 9:24 AM Author: cheese-eating haunted graveyard tyft (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15151682) |
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Date: June 3rd, 2010 9:30 AM Author: blathering aquamarine space becky it does. none of those fucking schools are getting biglaw. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15151695) |
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Date: June 16th, 2010 10:31 AM Author: blathering aquamarine space becky this is a truly epic thread. just wanted to say so. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15260375) |
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Date: June 16th, 2010 4:23 PM Author: Violet Comical Laser Beams Stage FWIW, I wasn't gunning for biglaw and got what I wanted (regional firm in my home area) so would not show up on this list. Most everyone I knew in my class just wanted to make market in a somewhat desirable place to live. Not too many V10 or die types although, yes, I'm sure if WLRK came knocking on the LR EIC's door, he'd take it in a heartbeat. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15262202) |
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Date: June 29th, 2010 11:03 AM Author: pea-brained nursing home gunner Thanks for this anecdote! I'm sure there are *lots* of people like you, regional at heart! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15373659) |
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Date: June 29th, 2010 11:20 AM Author: Buff place of business who got the CD CAL district ct clerkship? initials? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#15373714) |
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Date: November 16th, 2010 4:52 PM Author: lascivious stubborn police squad legend (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#16567033) |
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Date: February 3rd, 2011 4:03 PM Author: pea-brained nursing home gunner (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#17205913) |
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Date: January 12th, 2012 1:07 PM Author: lascivious stubborn police squad legend (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1307833&forum_id=2#19768032) |