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Has "calories in / calories out" been DEBUNKED?

...
Excitant Hateful Weed Whacker Native
  12/18/22
it's been rebunked
orchid menage famous landscape painting
  12/18/22
...
Maize useless brakes
  12/21/22
it's entirely correct. the caveat is that 2 foods of the sam...
180 spruce generalized bond
  12/18/22
/thread unfortunately you'll get ppl here who will disagre...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
Seed oils and other bad shit may have bad health consequence...
180 spruce generalized bond
  12/18/22
the nutritional literature over-fucking-whelmingly confirms ...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
Oh come on, man. While I generally agree with your statement...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
ctrl + f "mice" shut the fuck up show me HUMAN O...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
It’s about interestified food oils, not “vegetab...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
I don;t know, but that you think a fucking mouse study is mo...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
seed oils aren't "inflammatory" in humans, retard ...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
Holy shit you are dumb. I don’t know why I’m eve...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
You brought up a retarded mouse study to argue that vegetabl...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
So let me get this straight. I point out that industrial foo...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
unnatural tho
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/19/22
cr
claret legal warrant
  12/18/22
They're so dumb. "But I'm different! The laws of therm...
Wonderful mewling principal's office psychic
  12/18/22
Pure calories in calories out has been debunked yes. For exa...
drab sanctuary
  12/18/22
absolutely all nutritional studies are total horseshit, carb...
comical regret property
  12/18/22
Lol that’s real retarded sir
drab sanctuary
  12/18/22
oh I'm sure when they asked guys who eat 3 donuts and 4 loav...
comical regret property
  12/18/22
Wtf you are talking about?
drab sanctuary
  12/18/22
nutritional studies tracking calories in/out are based on se...
comical regret property
  12/18/22
Nah I’m referring to a controlled trial where there we...
drab sanctuary
  12/18/22
well different metabolic impact just means fewer calories ou...
comical regret property
  12/18/22
1. It doesn’t mean that as the term is used, otherwise...
drab sanctuary
  12/18/22
calories in is what you're discussing calories out is a s...
comical regret property
  12/18/22
That could be an aspect of it (increasing metabolism I guess...
drab sanctuary
  12/18/22
I agree that how it is processed has an effect, but at the e...
comical regret property
  12/18/22
By “disproven” I assume you mean that most peopl...
Racy Address Mental Disorder
  12/18/22
didn't know people still believed Gary Taubes in 2022 lmao
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
I'm hyper-intelligent and hyper-neurotic so my brain demolis...
laughsome corner
  12/18/22
Curious how "caloric value" is measured. If I eat ...
topaz big hell hominid
  12/18/22
what the guy above said is utterly retarded Gary Taubes hocu...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
this is absolutely false
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
not what the studies show actually, dumbass https://pubmed....
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
...
claret legal warrant
  12/18/22
"a high carb diet" is the "in," not the ...
snowy supple fanboi
  12/19/22
It's not about CICO per se, it's about how CICO bros totally...
crimson disgusting stage jewess
  12/18/22
It’s still largely correct, but the caveat is that it ...
Racy Address Mental Disorder
  12/18/22
this combined with shit diets almost always resulting in les...
comical regret property
  12/18/22
As a broad approximation CICO is correct, but it ignores thi...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
I actually disagree with the cutting thing. It’s way e...
Racy Address Mental Disorder
  12/18/22
...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
I’m using “cut” here to refer to shedding ...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
sounds like hocus pocus mechanistic BS body builders defini...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
It’s not hocus-pocus; it’s very basic nutrition ...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
you lose less muscle mass (vs fat mass) when you prioritize ...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
So let me get this straight. You are saying: (1) I am an idi...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
if by "different outcomes" you mean different weig...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
So you think that if suddenly started eating only 1500 calor...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
yes
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
look up Kevin Hall, PhD. He literally tests this kind of shi...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/18/22
I looked through his select publications and this is the onl...
Onyx cerebral patrolman
  12/18/22
You're correct and the poasters you're replying to don't und...
impressive abnormal kitchen
  12/19/22
nope, retard https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26278052/
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/19/22
No fucking shit caloric restriction is necessary -- but you ...
impressive abnormal kitchen
  12/20/22
...
impressive abnormal kitchen
  12/18/22
...
impressive abnormal kitchen
  12/18/22
I feel like OP wanted a lazy 100 poast thread in his 'by you...
clear idiotic kitty cat
  12/18/22
...
Excitant Hateful Weed Whacker Native
  12/19/22
...
Swashbuckling Parlour Twinkling Uncleanness
  12/18/22
The calories in, calories out argument is pretty stupid. ...
Swashbuckling Parlour Twinkling Uncleanness
  12/18/22
i debunked the fuck out of this when I pointed out that you ...
very tactful tattoo dingle berry
  12/19/22
Sounds like it was never "in."
snowy supple fanboi
  12/19/22
Calories in should be treated as an upper bound. So if your ...
Mind-boggling obsidian plaza
  12/19/22
seems right. i genuinely dont believe that if i sat and ate...
very tactful tattoo dingle berry
  12/19/22
cr 100 calories of celery vs 100 calories of cane sugar w...
Mind-boggling obsidian plaza
  12/19/22
This is because corn is highly bio-unavailable, due to how d...
impressive abnormal kitchen
  12/21/22
I've read nuts like almonds aren't very calorically bio-avai...
Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party
  12/21/22
See above. If fatties would treat CI as an upper bound then ...
Mind-boggling obsidian plaza
  12/21/22
Yeah just make sure to avoid going into starvation mode too
Flesh low-t nursing home
  12/19/22
thermodynamics has been debunked! of course it's not so s...
bipolar autistic space
  12/19/22
"Caloric deficit" isnt a thermodynamic concept. Al...
Sooty step-uncle's house organic girlfriend
  12/21/22
Technically, all that matters is mass in and mass out.
Sooty step-uncle's house organic girlfriend
  12/21/22
disco fries strangely absent from this thread
bright cuckoldry
  12/21/22
...
stimulating ruddy site
  07/05/25


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 7:27 PM
Author: Excitant Hateful Weed Whacker Native



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652660)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 7:50 PM
Author: orchid menage famous landscape painting

it's been rebunked

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652751)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 21st, 2022 5:00 PM
Author: Maize useless brakes



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45670428)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 7:58 PM
Author: 180 spruce generalized bond

it's entirely correct. the caveat is that 2 foods of the same calories may not fill you up in the same way and satisfy u. so it's not just calories -- it's eating nutritious food that is calorie efficient.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652779)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:35 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

/thread

unfortunately you'll get ppl here who will disagree with you and blame it solely on seed oils or something retarded



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652923)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:43 PM
Author: 180 spruce generalized bond

Seed oils and other bad shit may have bad health consequences but thread is simply about weight gain or loss

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652948)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:47 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

the nutritional literature over-fucking-whelmingly confirms the health-promoting benefits of vegetable oils when consumed in place of saturated fat and/or refined carbs. E.g., cooking and baking with olive oil/canola oil instead of butter.

However, what people here do is equate these oils with the ultra processed food that often contains the oils. Those are two different things. The "seed oil" in the Oreo isn't what's making you fat. It's the Oreo that's making you fat.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652970)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:21 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

Oh come on, man. While I generally agree with your statements about some vegetable/seed oils, the highly processed fats found in industrialized baked goods like Oreos are uniquely bad for you.

Until about 10 years ago, almost all the fats found in Oreos were partially hydrogenated, producing trans fats (which could be labeled as unsaturated fats even though they behaved like saturated fats) via trans-cis isomerism. Since trans fats have been banned, industrial food-oil producers have turned to fat interestification to create triglycerides that would not be found in the sources the oils are derived from. Early looks at interestified fats seem to show they seem to promote inflammation and adipose tissue growth.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30813339/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653145)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:26 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

ctrl + f "mice"

shut the fuck up

show me HUMAN OUTCOME DATA that demonstrates "seed oils" are bad for you

EVERYTHING with human outcome data demonstrates they're health-promoting when consumed in isolation (not wrapped up on junk food) when replacing saturated fat

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653156)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:30 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

It’s about interestified food oils, not “vegetable oils”

Why don’t you walk me through how you think food studies in humans work.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653175)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:32 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

I don;t know, but that you think a fucking mouse study is more probative tells me you dont know what the fuck youre talking about

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653191)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:29 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

seed oils aren't "inflammatory" in humans, retard

https://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/8/3/136/htm

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S2405457720302047

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4050683/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27737722/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5587404/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653169)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:46 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

Holy shit you are dumb. I don’t know why I’m even bothering to engage with you when you clearly don’t have the capacity to get it. I said I generally agreed with your “seed oil” points. I just pointed out that Oreos were made with trans-fats (previously) and fully hydrogenated / interestified fats today.

Why don’t you go eat a tub of 1990s margarine if you love unsaturated vegetable oils so much.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653232)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:49 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

You brought up a retarded mouse study to argue that vegetable oils are “possibly” inflammatory in humans

You also argued that ten years ago some vegetable oils were partially hydrogenated

I rightly pointed out that you’re a retard

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653243)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 10:00 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

So let me get this straight. I point out that industrial food oils are completely unnatural interestified fats and provided a study that shows they may be harmful. Then you took that to mean that all vegetable oils are interestified? And you think that the other person, not you, is the retarded party, despite all the evidence you’ve provided in this thread. Is that correct?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653300)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 19th, 2022 2:40 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

unnatural tho

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45656831)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 10:04 PM
Author: claret legal warrant

cr

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653325)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:47 PM
Author: Wonderful mewling principal's office psychic

They're so dumb. "But I'm different! The laws of thermodynamics do not apply to me!"

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653235)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:01 PM
Author: drab sanctuary

Pure calories in calories out has been debunked yes. For example, studies show a high carb diet will cause weight gain over a low carb diet even if the diets have the same caloric value. Anyone who doesn’t realize this intuitively also is a little dim imo.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652790)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:02 PM
Author: comical regret property

absolutely all nutritional studies are total horseshit, carbs probably just made people lazier

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652794)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:06 PM
Author: drab sanctuary

Lol that’s real retarded sir

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652808)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:06 PM
Author: comical regret property

oh I'm sure when they asked guys who eat 3 donuts and 4 loaves of bread a day how active they are they were 100% honest

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652809)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:07 PM
Author: drab sanctuary

Wtf you are talking about?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652813)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:08 PM
Author: comical regret property

nutritional studies tracking calories in/out are based on self reported levels of intake and activity, which is why they are entirely flame, they aren't hooking fat guys up to electrodes for months on end you enormous retard

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652817)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:10 PM
Author: drab sanctuary

Nah I’m referring to a controlled trial where there were 3 groups. Low carb, medium carb, high carb. The diets were pre assigned and tracked. Obviously I’m not referring to some “study” conducted by a questionnaire.

But seriously you think eating 3k calories of refined carbs will have the same metabolic impact of eating 3k calories of steak? If so you have a lot of learning to do.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652826)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:12 PM
Author: comical regret property

well different metabolic impact just means fewer calories out, moron, I never said eating pure sugar was good for you, just that it comes down to the same thing at the end of the day

also those trials are also just people saying what they did

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652828)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:16 PM
Author: drab sanctuary

1. It doesn’t mean that as the term is used, otherwise it would be a useless term.

2. No they aren’t, as I just explained. Controlled trials where subjects were fed different diets assigned to them.

The study shows the impact on weight gain that different diets have even if the calories are the exact same. This means that determining whether a diet is advantageous based purely on its caloric content is faulty.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652850)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:17 PM
Author: comical regret property

calories in is what you're discussing

calories out is a separate matter that you are entirely ignoring, yes a diet of pure bread is going to make you fatter, because your fat ass won't burn as many calories for a variety of reasons, one being that you only eat bread

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652857)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:25 PM
Author: drab sanctuary

That could be an aspect of it (increasing metabolism I guess) but another aspect I think is more significant is that heavy carb intake leads to higher weight gain because of how it is processed by the body and how it can contribute to insulin resistance. The fact is high carb diets have excess calories that are not nutritious and not used by the body and have to be stored as fat.

I believe the calories in calories out meme is those trying to say eating whatever you want is fine so long as you track the calories, which has been disproven I’d say in terms of weight gain and body composition

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652895)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:26 PM
Author: comical regret property

I agree that how it is processed has an effect, but at the end of the day if you go out and burn a calorie you burned a goddamed calorie and there's no getting around that, your body doesn't have magic reserves of extra secret carb calories that will never be used

the confounding factors are what makes it seem this way to you

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652903)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:43 PM
Author: Racy Address Mental Disorder

By “disproven” I assume you mean that most people who use that dietary approach as a means of losing significant weight eventually fail. But that’s true of all diets because most people can’t do anything consistently for long term benefits. That’s why median retirement savings are a joke, and most people in the US are overweight and prediabetic.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652953)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:53 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

didn't know people still believed Gary Taubes in 2022 lmao

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653007)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:03 PM
Author: laughsome corner

I'm hyper-intelligent and hyper-neurotic so my brain demolishes glucose all day every day

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652797)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:12 PM
Author: topaz big hell hominid

Curious how "caloric value" is measured. If I eat 2000 calories of carrots, I assume I will gain less weight than if I eat 2000 calories of sugar cookies, simply because carrots take more energy to break down.

I wonder if any studies have compared "pure CICO" with "linear net CICO", as distinct from "nonlinear" claims of complex dietary interactions.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652829)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:36 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

what the guy above said is utterly retarded Gary Taubes hocus pocus horseshit

the nutritional literature absolutely supports the energy balance hypothesis

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652933)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:35 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

this is absolutely false

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652926)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:41 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

not what the studies show actually, dumbass

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29466592/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33479499/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652943)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 10:06 PM
Author: claret legal warrant



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653335)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 19th, 2022 3:10 PM
Author: snowy supple fanboi

"a high carb diet" is the "in," not the "out."

If you're not addressing both, you're failing.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45657003)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:19 PM
Author: crimson disgusting stage jewess

It's not about CICO per se, it's about how CICO bros totally ignore things like what carbs/sugar do to one's blood glucose levels versus fat. Discuss.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652866)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:23 PM
Author: Racy Address Mental Disorder

It’s still largely correct, but the caveat is that it may be substantially easier to limit calories on certain types of diets. For me, that’s low carb. I lost 40 lbs without counting any calories. But the thing that let me build mass but also get a six pack was calorie counting. It’s super effective if you are hyper focused on nutrition and can stick to your targets.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652886)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:24 PM
Author: comical regret property

this combined with shit diets almost always resulting in less activity and caloric burn

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652891)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:30 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

As a broad approximation CICO is correct, but it ignores things like the thermic effect of food, insulin response, meal timing, and the impact of a whole slew of other hormones on body composition.

CICO will keep you in a normal BMI, but you’ll never really get cut with it unless you get lucky

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652911)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:35 PM
Author: Racy Address Mental Disorder

I actually disagree with the cutting thing. It’s way easier to get cut if you know you are running a consistent and reasonable caloric deficit.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652924)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:48 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652982)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:50 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

I’m using “cut” here to refer to shedding body fat and water to promote high muscle definition, not simply losing weight (e.g. cutting to make weight for wrestling). You will definitely lose weight running a caloric deficit, but your body composition at the end of your diet will be highly impacted by your level of activity, the macronutrient profile of what you eat, the hormonal responses the food creates, and the timing of when you eat it (such as keeping blood sugar and insulin levels low when liponeogenesis most commonly occurs).

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45652995)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 8:51 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

sounds like hocus pocus mechanistic BS

body builders definitely count calories and eat a ton of protein. Eat a high protein diet that's calorically deficient. That's how you cut.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653001)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:03 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

It’s not hocus-pocus; it’s very basic nutrition science that every successful bodybuilder is familiar with. A former Mr. Olympia competitor is who originally taught me about it.

And anyways, isn’t your second statement exactly what I was saying (just dumber and less informed) and completely at odds with your “CICO is entirely correct” absolutism above? If it was CICO-only, why would eating a ton of protein matter?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653069)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2022 9:07 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

you lose less muscle mass (vs fat mass) when you prioritize protein consumption in a caloric deficit. Has nothing to do with CICO.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653088)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 9:28 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

So let me get this straight. You are saying: (1) I am an idiot for saying, among other things, that what you eat impacts your body composition and an equal amount of calories in two different foods result in different outcomes, and (2) what you eat impacts your body composition and an equal amount of calories in two different foods will result in different outcomes. Also, CICO is absolutely the only thing that matters, but also CICO has nothing to do with it.

Do I have that correct?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653167)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 9:32 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

if by "different outcomes" you mean different weight, then yes you're a retard

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653187)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 9:42 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

So you think that if suddenly started eating only 1500 calories daily, all in pure fat, I would lose exactly the same amount of weight as if I ate 1500 calories consisting entirely of carbs, and the same as if I ate 1500 calories only if protein? I would just lose different types of tissues, but an equal weight in all cases?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653219)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 9:44 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

yes

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653225)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 9:45 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

look up Kevin Hall, PhD. He literally tests this kind of shit in a metabolic ward setting.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653229)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 10:02 PM
Author: Onyx cerebral patrolman

I looked through his select publications and this is the only one that looked remotely related to what we were talking about: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26278052/ Unfortunately is doesn’t have anything to say in the abstract about non-adipose tissue loss.

This comment on another person’s paper may have also addressed some of it, but it’s paywalled and I can’t read it. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/article-abstract/2686143

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653316)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 9:01 PM
Author: impressive abnormal kitchen

You're correct and the poasters you're replying to don't understand how insulin works, or how the body uses macronutrients differently

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45658963)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 9:05 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

nope, retard

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26278052/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45658978)



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Date: December 20th, 2022 7:08 AM
Author: impressive abnormal kitchen

No fucking shit caloric restriction is necessary -- but you should also precisely breakdown which macros you need so you don't ruin insulin sensitivity or underfeed protein and lose muscle mass. Furthermore, some macro ratios are much better for fat loss, retard.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32699189/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45660501)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 8:56 PM
Author: impressive abnormal kitchen



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653024)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 8:57 PM
Author: impressive abnormal kitchen



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653025)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 9:17 PM
Author: clear idiotic kitty cat

I feel like OP wanted a lazy 100 poast thread in his 'by you'.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653131)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 3:48 PM
Author: Excitant Hateful Weed Whacker Native



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45657263)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 11:03 PM
Author: Swashbuckling Parlour Twinkling Uncleanness



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653661)



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Date: December 18th, 2022 11:03 PM
Author: Swashbuckling Parlour Twinkling Uncleanness

The calories in, calories out argument is pretty stupid.

Yeah, obviously the more of something you eat, the more calories you consume, the more likely you are to gain weight.

But it should be even more obvious that it can't *only* be calories in calories out. It should be evident to even a 5 year old that your body isn't going to process eating ice cream every day vs gorging yourself in one sitting, or drinking sugar water vs celery, in the same way. Plus, everyone shits and everyone shits differently.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45653663)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 2:37 PM
Author: very tactful tattoo dingle berry

i debunked the fuck out of this when I pointed out that you shit out corn kernels. That shit was NOT metabolized at all.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45656807)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 3:13 PM
Author: snowy supple fanboi

Sounds like it was never "in."

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45657021)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 3:18 PM
Author: Mind-boggling obsidian plaza

Calories in should be treated as an upper bound. So if your total intake is under your maintenance you will necessarily lose weight.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45657057)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 3:48 PM
Author: very tactful tattoo dingle berry

seems right.

i genuinely dont believe that if i sat and ate a 10,000 calorie cake right now that my body would digest and metabolize the whole thing. I think it would be like lol bro that was a lot of sugar and pass it through and id poop it out

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45657260)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 4:20 PM
Author: Mind-boggling obsidian plaza

cr

100 calories of celery vs 100 calories of cane sugar will obviously be digested differently and have different net caloric effects, but either way you can absorb at most 100 calories from each. So if you eat say 1500 calories per day you will lose weight, even though you can lose more depending on the foods that make up that 1500

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45657455)



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Date: December 21st, 2022 4:27 PM
Author: impressive abnormal kitchen

This is because corn is highly bio-unavailable, due to how dense the cellulose is.

"100 calories" of corn will not be metabolized the same as 100 calories of sweet potatoes, despite both being complex carbs, due to bioavailability. Moreover, 100 calories of simple carbs will not be digested the same as 100 calories of fats; depending on insulin levels at time of consuming either, you will have radically different rates of metabolism (or fat storage).

Running a caloric deficit is a necessary but insufficient condition for optimal fat loss.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45670256)



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Date: December 21st, 2022 4:29 PM
Author: Primrose Swollen Senate Reading Party

I've read nuts like almonds aren't very calorically bio-available or whatever.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45670268)



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Date: December 21st, 2022 4:38 PM
Author: Mind-boggling obsidian plaza

See above. If fatties would treat CI as an upper bound then they would lose weight. Instead they hand wave about how foods are digested and "hormones".

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45670305)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 2:41 PM
Author: Flesh low-t nursing home

Yeah just make sure to avoid going into starvation mode too

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45656834)



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Date: December 19th, 2022 3:14 PM
Author: bipolar autistic space

thermodynamics has been debunked!

of course it's not so simple as "calories in, calories out" as different calories are processed differently by different people. but it is physically impossible to run at a caloric deficit and gain weight.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45657025)



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Date: December 21st, 2022 5:17 PM
Author: Sooty step-uncle's house organic girlfriend

"Caloric deficit" isnt a thermodynamic concept. All that matters is conservation of mass.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45670525)



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Date: December 21st, 2022 5:09 PM
Author: Sooty step-uncle's house organic girlfriend

Technically, all that matters is mass in and mass out.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45670473)



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Date: December 21st, 2022 5:29 PM
Author: bright cuckoldry

disco fries strangely absent from this thread

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#45670576)



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Date: July 5th, 2025 12:19 PM
Author: stimulating ruddy site



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5255189&forum_id=2...id#49073942)