\
  The most prestigious law school admissions discussion board in the world.
BackRefresh Options Favorite

I hate white-collar professionals who can't hack it in the rat race, quit, and

Then disguise their failures with ..."yeah I used to wo...
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
...
Aquamarine low-t address multi-billionaire
  02/19/17
...
Naked peach home
  12/01/18
...
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
...
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
chill out ted
Dead Liquid Oxygen
  02/19/17
...
Lascivious base reading party
  02/19/17
...
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
(3L who will last 2 years tops in biglaw)
Pea-brained racy pit
  02/19/17
he's not even in law school anymore iirc
Wonderful sound barrier nursing home
  02/19/17
LJL He also couldn't even get into a good lawl school
Charismatic Jewess
  02/21/17
hi, i sucked at that life, dropped out, went into academia a...
Tan hilarious bawdyhouse newt
  02/19/17
You sound butthurt
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
no...i sucked at being a lawyer. if i stuck it out, i would...
Tan hilarious bawdyhouse newt
  02/19/17
you're the librarian bro right? cot damn im jelly
Charismatic Jewess
  02/21/17
180
Dark Metal Internal Respiration Dilemma
  02/19/17
...
Big-titted Free-loading Kitchen Stain
  02/19/17
There's definitely truth to this especially in law. 100% of ...
Brindle Hunting Ground Private Investor
  02/19/17
This is absolutely not true
Bateful school
  02/19/17
...
Charismatic Jewess
  02/21/17
Jesus no. Any job where value is priced in hours spent is ho...
self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease
  02/19/17
CR
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
As a practical matter, "hours" = # of hours report...
Harsh Citrine Jap
  02/19/17
IOW hours based billing just means that INDIVIDUALS, not fir...
Harsh Citrine Jap
  02/19/17
Law as a field is dominated by some of the worst incentive s...
self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease
  02/19/17
CR
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
There's just too much grinding and exhaustion in biglaw prac...
Charismatic Jewess
  02/21/17
No way
Yapping Know-it-all Bbw Elastic Band
  02/19/17
You're lying
Brindle Hunting Ground Private Investor
  02/19/17
If you vary the hypo to something with more relevance to the...
Titillating Ungodly Circlehead Feces
  02/19/17
Have been grinding for 9 years. Fortuitous penguin, etc.....
excitant gold plaza
  02/19/17
LOL NO I am far too lazy and value my free time.
Charismatic Jewess
  02/21/17
You have such a weird schtick
Bateful school
  02/19/17
(literally a guy who rails against "wagecucks" in ...
stimulating menage people who are hurt
  02/19/17
(literal wagecuck)
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
guess you are too thick to realize that you are effectively ...
stimulating menage people who are hurt
  02/19/17
...
Wonderful sound barrier nursing home
  02/19/17
...
Bistre Senate
  02/19/17
Calm down, Cohen
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
a lot of times when people say "i hate something",...
Jade codepig
  02/19/17
...
self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease
  02/19/17
bro they have me another 50k stock option (4 year vest) afte...
Jade codepig
  02/19/17
Your age?
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
32
Jade codepig
  02/19/17
If you're solid, they should refresh regularly. If they don'...
self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease
  02/19/17
wow nice. thanks for the tip man.
Jade codepig
  02/19/17
No worries. Another big thing to keep an eye out for is the ...
self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease
  02/19/17
refreshed?
excitant gold plaza
  02/19/17
180
Hot adventurous gay wizard
  02/20/17
(Freud)
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/19/17
easy there Sigmund, you'll blow an artery
glittery obsidian toilet seat
  12/01/18
You know, it's possible that not getting BIGLAW was a huge f...
flatulent mediation doctorate
  02/19/17
Right but you don't feel the need to lie about why you are w...
Big-titted Free-loading Kitchen Stain
  02/19/17
You know what it takes to sell real estate? It takes brass b...
orange shaky parlor
  02/19/17
Failure is not easy to deal with man. Leave those guys alone...
Big-titted Free-loading Kitchen Stain
  02/19/17
ITT: dopey dumb dumb talk
provocative chartreuse jew sanctuary
  02/20/17
Reminder. The Op made several posts that he was gunning hard...
Soul-stirring messiness
  02/20/17
Didn't he attend a TTT?
Charismatic Jewess
  02/21/17
I heard UC irvine. Pretty pathetic for an AA spic in this a...
Startling anal depressive
  02/21/17
...
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/21/17
...
Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth
  02/21/17
This is dumb, bro. Many biglawyers drop out because they com...
Charismatic Jewess
  02/21/17
People just hate change and disruption until it's forced upo...
Canary vigorous center
  02/21/17
((()))
violet contagious crotch
  02/21/17
OP: "If the job would have been more psychologically...
spectacular zombie-like theater stage
  02/21/17
...
Charismatic Jewess
  02/21/17
depends on whether they seem like they've found something th...
Milky Galvanic Spot
  02/21/17
...
Brindle Hunting Ground Private Investor
  12/01/18


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 3:17 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth

Then disguise their failures with ..."yeah I used to work for a major corporation, but then realized there is more to life than just money..." When in reality they would have loved to stay at their company if they had gotten promoted, gotten a raise, been able to compete with co-workers...

These ppl are filth and think they're above everyone.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32655763)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 6:07 PM
Author: Aquamarine low-t address multi-billionaire



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656885)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 1st, 2018 6:21 PM
Author: Naked peach home



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#37333403)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 3:20 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32655789)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 3:21 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32655797)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 3:22 PM
Author: Dead Liquid Oxygen

chill out ted

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32655799)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:14 PM
Author: Lascivious base reading party



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656495)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 4:55 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656401)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 4:55 PM
Author: Pea-brained racy pit

(3L who will last 2 years tops in biglaw)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656407)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 4:57 PM
Author: Wonderful sound barrier nursing home

he's not even in law school anymore iirc

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656418)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:26 PM
Author: Charismatic Jewess

LJL

He also couldn't even get into a good lawl school

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669766)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 4:58 PM
Author: Tan hilarious bawdyhouse newt

hi, i sucked at that life, dropped out, went into academia and have a life most people envy at 1/3 the salary. sup?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656424)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:13 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth

You sound butthurt

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656491)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 10:07 PM
Author: Tan hilarious bawdyhouse newt

no...i sucked at being a lawyer. if i stuck it out, i would have been shitcanned and miserable. now im pretty happy even if i'm relatively broke. these are the tradeoffs one makes.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32658466)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:48 PM
Author: Charismatic Jewess

you're the librarian bro right?

cot damn im jelly

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32670000)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:29 PM
Author: Dark Metal Internal Respiration Dilemma

180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656591)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 11:32 PM
Author: Big-titted Free-loading Kitchen Stain



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32659028)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:14 PM
Author: Brindle Hunting Ground Private Investor

There's definitely truth to this especially in law. 100% of associates would grind for 10 years if there was a guaranteed v10 equity partnership at the end

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656496)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:16 PM
Author: Bateful school

This is absolutely not true

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656505)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:27 PM
Author: Charismatic Jewess



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669779)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:18 PM
Author: self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease

Jesus no. Any job where value is priced in hours spent is horrible.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656521)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:24 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth

CR

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656557)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:58 PM
Author: Harsh Citrine Jap

As a practical matter, "hours" = # of hours reported = # of hours ppl think they can get away with reporting = in expectation, the max # of hours that can be reported without being flagged by whatever fraud detection devices one reasonably expects will be used.

Hence it would be perfectly reasonable for a firm to separate their tangible work production, from their hours reporting. And it is just as rational to do this on an individual level.

Yet people grind themselves down trying to robotically meet a rigid hours hours requirement, when they could invest in increasing their personal efficiency, meet the facetime requirements, and then report the same number of hours.

Surely this is due to the sort of childish manichean thinking that runs rampant among lawyers.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656833)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 6:01 PM
Author: Harsh Citrine Jap

IOW hours based billing just means that INDIVIDUALS, not firms and clients, get to reap the benefits of innovation (real efficiency gains). Hence if anything it is a cause for celebration if you are an innovative individual - you can get a steady paycheck and advance without getting more work heaped on you.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656852)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 6:10 PM
Author: self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease

Law as a field is dominated by some of the worst incentive structures I have ever seen.

I remember trying to convince my firm to drop my hours requirement in exchange for bringing in additional work (since I was better at building a book than grinding away). They weren't willing to compromise.

I left.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656908)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 8:22 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth

CR

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32657774)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:30 PM
Author: Charismatic Jewess

There's just too much grinding and exhaustion in biglaw practice....the detail orientedness is awful and exhausting, the ASAP fire drills, the on call, the hours, etc.

Also it literally wastes away your entire youth. Most senior biglawyers are disgusting physical specimens of obesity, baldness, etc. ....so gross.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669816)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:25 PM
Author: Yapping Know-it-all Bbw Elastic Band

No way

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656568)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 9:25 PM
Author: Brindle Hunting Ground Private Investor

You're lying

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32658138)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 10:42 PM
Author: Titillating Ungodly Circlehead Feces

If you vary the hypo to something with more relevance to the biglaw business model and that's more appealing it's still a somewhat tough call. e.g. 2nd year associate has college buddy who randomly hits it big and now 2nd year controls a $15M book of business. This is basically the dream biglaw scenario and it would still involve supervising a huge volume of boring ass nonsense that 2nd year's buddy would not give two shits about, but 2nd year would have to supervise properly or he could end up fucking over his friend and being disbarred. 2nd year is having to fend off another partner every week trying to get a taste, and play all the politics to make sure they get a fair share of profits. There are just much better ways to make a living.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32658693)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 11:25 PM
Author: excitant gold plaza

Have been grinding for 9 years.

Fortuitous penguin, etc...

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32658979)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:26 PM
Author: Charismatic Jewess

LOL NO

I am far too lazy and value my free time.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669772)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:15 PM
Author: Bateful school

You have such a weird schtick

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656503)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:16 PM
Author: stimulating menage people who are hurt

(literally a guy who rails against "wagecucks" in spite after failing in his bid for a white-collar career)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656506)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:19 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth

(literal wagecuck)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656529)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:22 PM
Author: stimulating menage people who are hurt

guess you are too thick to realize that you are effectively describing yourself in op

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656547)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:23 PM
Author: Wonderful sound barrier nursing home



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656549)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:26 PM
Author: Bistre Senate



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656573)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:32 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth

Calm down, Cohen

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656622)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:21 PM
Author: Jade codepig

a lot of times when people say "i hate something", it's usually they hating something about themselves which they project to something else.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656544)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:23 PM
Author: self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656552)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:43 PM
Author: Jade codepig

bro they have me another 50k stock option (4 year vest) after i had worked there for 11 month.. the second option sheet 5x'ed the first option sheet in price.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656708)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:51 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth

Your age?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656777)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:56 PM
Author: Jade codepig

32

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656813)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:55 PM
Author: self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease

If you're solid, they should refresh regularly. If they don't then vest into your first cliff and bail unless things are going super well.

Our first employee (who has been crushing it) has been refreshed 3x in his first year. Dude is killing himself for the cause and he deserves the recognition.

EDIT: I'm also big on refreshing and adjusting salary proactively. Find it has a way larger impact. We've had 0 people leave willingly in ~18months

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656799)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:56 PM
Author: Jade codepig

wow nice. thanks for the tip man.



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656811)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 6:07 PM
Author: self-absorbed internet-worthy box office mad cow disease

No worries. Another big thing to keep an eye out for is the 409a price versus the last round as well as the % you get rather than the raw number of shares.

Generally, joining after Series A isn't a great idea unless the company is super well positioned or if you are there for career progression rather than trying to hit a jackpot.

Glad to hear you're out there making it happen.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656884)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 11:24 PM
Author: excitant gold plaza

refreshed?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32658971)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 20th, 2017 1:21 AM
Author: Hot adventurous gay wizard

180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32659679)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 5:24 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth

(Freud)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32656556)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 1st, 2018 6:54 PM
Author: glittery obsidian toilet seat

easy there Sigmund, you'll blow an artery

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#37333540)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 10:43 PM
Author: flatulent mediation doctorate

You know, it's possible that not getting BIGLAW was a huge failure on my part, AND that my life is better because of it. Both of those things could be true.

In fact, I believe both are.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32658701)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 11:31 PM
Author: Big-titted Free-loading Kitchen Stain

Right but you don't feel the need to lie about why you are where you are.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32659022)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 11:06 PM
Author: orange shaky parlor

You know what it takes to sell real estate? It takes brass balls to sell real estate.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32658850)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 19th, 2017 11:30 PM
Author: Big-titted Free-loading Kitchen Stain

Failure is not easy to deal with man. Leave those guys alone.

It's understandable that people have a need to rationalize their fates internally and also not want to be viewed as a failure by others.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32659012)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 20th, 2017 1:25 AM
Author: provocative chartreuse jew sanctuary

ITT: dopey dumb dumb talk

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32659684)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 20th, 2017 2:34 AM
Author: Soul-stirring messiness

Reminder. The Op made several posts that he was gunning hard for big law. Even with affirmative action this spic couldn't cop biglaw

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32659805)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:27 PM
Author: Charismatic Jewess

Didn't he attend a TTT?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669784)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:47 PM
Author: Startling anal depressive

I heard UC irvine. Pretty pathetic for an AA spic in this application cycle

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669989)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:10 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669618)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:20 PM
Author: Kink-friendly useless brakes scourge upon the earth



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669723)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:28 PM
Author: Charismatic Jewess

This is dumb, bro. Many biglawyers drop out because they come from family money or married rich and no longer need to grind. Reminder: not working for money >>>> working for money.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669790)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:28 PM
Author: Canary vigorous center

People just hate change and disruption until it's forced upon them. Those who are successful at a job tend to care a lot more than those who fail.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669791)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:39 PM
Author: violet contagious crotch

((()))

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669927)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:43 PM
Author: spectacular zombie-like theater stage

OP:

"If the job would have been more psychologically, socially, and financially rewarding, the cost-benefit analysis would have changed."

Great insight.



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669963)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:45 PM
Author: Charismatic Jewess



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32669977)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2017 2:49 PM
Author: Milky Galvanic Spot

depends on whether they seem like they've found something they genuinely think is more important to do with their lives or if they are obviously rationalizing away their failures

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#32670006)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 1st, 2018 6:19 PM
Author: Brindle Hunting Ground Private Investor



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3530729&forum_id=2#37333392)