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GS had 600 traders in U.S. cash equities trading desk in 2000, now 2
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:15 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator "At its height back in 2000, the U.S. cash equities trading desk at Goldman Sachs's New York headquarters employed 600 traders, buying and selling stock on the orders of the investment bank's large clients. Today there are just two equity traders left.
Automated trading programs have taken over the rest of the work, supported by 200 computer engineers."
Doesn't sound right. Is it misleading in someway? Like were the traders essentially low level clerks? Did they have career tracks?
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/603431/as-goldman-embraces-automation-even-the-masters-of-the-universe-are-threatened/ |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:18 AM Author: Cracking Nighttime Orchestra Pit sounds about right (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660862) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:31 AM Author: sable locus dingle berry (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660956) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:20 AM Author: Vigorous Ungodly Whorehouse they were normal traders like everyone else
equity is too competitive and too efficient to support that many people anymore |
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Date: March 25th, 2019 12:38 PM Author: Pontificating cyan gunner partner No, this is dead right. Most if not all stock traders from this period were glorified real estate agents, except instead of doing all the paperwork and showing people houses - they just picked up the phones and pocketed a commission.
That was it, no business school background or even a college education was required. These people made hundreds of thousands of dollars a year doing this from the eighties up to the financial crisis of 2008 or so. These people ascended the ranks of financial institutions during this period. These people helped to cause 2008. |
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Date: March 25th, 2019 12:40 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator By they had some kind of talent right? Why would GS keep them in particular around without some kind of talent? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37986836) |
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Date: March 25th, 2019 12:42 PM Author: passionate faggot firefighter house Lmao (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37986848) |
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Date: March 25th, 2019 12:42 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator Somebody was paying their wages so had to ask this (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37986850) |
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Date: March 25th, 2019 12:47 PM Author: passionate faggot firefighter house their "talent" was that they were able to be shameless lying scumbags while working 80 hours a week. that's it (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37986878) |
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Date: March 26th, 2019 11:15 AM Author: Canary flirting station gay wizard they weren't working anywhere close to 80 hours a week (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37992565) |
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Date: March 25th, 2019 12:47 PM Author: cerebral gay native There was still a market for older people who weren't comfortable with new trading apps/platform who still wanted to phone it in like they had decades ago. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37986883) |
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Date: March 25th, 2019 12:46 PM Author: Pontificating cyan gunner partner A lot of the time they know where the bodies are buried - from high level exec misbehavior to firm wide corruption or activity that regulators could sanction or their job was contractually protected when the bank they worked for got bought by GS (more rare) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37986874) |
Date: February 20th, 2017 11:20 AM Author: galvanic friendly grandma business firm No this is right. Stock trading is almost completely automated.
Margins used to be huge (commissions, spreads) so it was a decent career for many people. Now, lol no. |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:25 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator So it was the Internet basically that wiped out this career? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660904) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:27 AM Author: galvanic friendly grandma business firm automation through algo trading mostly, low cost internet brokers and passive index ETFs also have some effect (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660917) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 12:00 PM Author: Umber odious jewess space it was immigrants, bro (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32661128) |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 3:34 PM Author: grizzly state stock car also created a small army of programmers and non-coding trading tech jerbs, along with lucrative HFT jerbs. work market hours and starting salary for essentially being specialized tech support for HFs is like 75k. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37119058) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:21 AM Author: high-end chapel Meanwhile they keep graduating more finance majors to drive Ubers. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660887) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:23 AM Author: citrine senate boltzmann zero hedge is great (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660899) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:26 AM Author: high-end chapel Banks are now just software companies. If that DOL fiduciary rule comes back that will neuter the money management side of their business still further. It effectively halved their fees. You cant go to college to be a banker anymore. That shit is over. Once blockchain becomes the defacto currency they can gut compliance and back office functions because with blockchain KYC and AML become ridiculously easy. If banks are 1/3 coders right now in 3-4 years as blockchain becomes standard that will jump to 60%. This isnt really a Goldman problem because they dont have a major retail shop but a JPMorgan will fire 30-50,000 people once blockchain replaces credit cards and currency. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660907) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:29 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator Can't understand the significance of blockchain for finance. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660930) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:29 AM Author: galvanic friendly grandma business firm it's flame. at best it will do away with some settlement costs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660938) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:32 AM Author: Pontificating cyan gunner partner that is a big understatement - there is an enormous amount of applications when it comes to other parts of the financial system re: settlement and clearing/repo market/bank to bank transactions/insurance applications (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660962) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:35 AM Author: galvanic friendly grandma business firm nobody is going to trust this hacker technology.
you're doing deals with notional values in the millions or billions.
you're worried about saving a buck using some low-rent clearing solution?
the whole premise is flame, and these technologies have a lot of flaws and unknowns. look at how someone made an eth contract that hacked the entire system last year. huge mess and unnecessary risk. |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:42 AM Author: high-end chapel People said this about the trading systems too and now all the traders are with the dinosaurs in heaven. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32661021) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 12:20 PM Author: Scarlet Lodge what a retarded analysis
"no one will ever trust this emerging technology, because its status as an emerging technology will remain completely static forever even though huge institutions are spending a ton of money investigating and refining it" |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 3:43 PM Author: Sick racy mediation this is an incredibly braindead take from someone who has either never worked in the financial sector or who is terrified of a paradigm shift therein. Is that you Jamie? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38272919) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:36 AM Author: high-end chapel TCR. A lot of stuff is STILL done on very old and very shitty mainframe back ends. These databases are functionally limited and the data in them just is no good for a lot of what banks do so you have legions of people doing very route things because the software is shit. If nothing else blockchain is driving a move away from 50 year old legacy software. In KYC it will kill probably 80% of the jobs people do. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660987) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:37 AM Author: Pontificating cyan gunner partner It's truly shocking once you get to peer into the guts of high finance how antiquated and shoddy the architecture is.
The degree and scale of waste is astounding.
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:59 AM Author: high-end chapel Yeah, there are still actual dudes coding Cobol in the basement. It's ridiculous. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32661124) |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 3:39 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator Has there been any adoption of blockchain in finance? Or is it just updating the framework (but calling it blockchain even if it's not accurate)? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37119088) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 12:01 PM Author: Umber odious jewess space look on the bright side! you can go to college to become a compliance monkey! what a fulfilling life! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32661134) |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 3:42 PM Author: Brass crotch "Once blockchain becomes the defacto currency"
Lmao retard |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:30 AM Author: Pontificating cyan gunner partner Trading was more of a vocational thing/process that was a holdover from a bygone era. Due to the "democratization" of the stock market from a period where it was dominated by banks, insurance companies and wealthy individuals which began to cease after WWII with the rise of the masses of "Retail Investors." This shift in the market structure, combined with anachronistic technology and commissions structures inherent in trading/clearing that remained until the Buttonwood Agreement was dissolved in like 2000, allowed people who were essentially switch board connectors or glorified real estate agents to become quite wealthy in proportion to the net benefit they delivered to society for about a 30~50 year period
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:32 AM Author: galvanic friendly grandma business firm at least it provided good jobs for a large group of somewhat normal people. now 2 MIT PhD quants and their bosses make all the money. is that progress? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660965) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:35 AM Author: Pontificating cyan gunner partner Dude I wish it was back to the old ways, especially now that I'm deeper in the industry and have certs where I could actually benefit and have a rewarding career ahead of me since I'm under 30.
I've had to deal with brainless no-talent boomers in finance who came up on a trading desk doing almost 0 work and then they rose into upper management. It's fucking terrible. The worst part is, the ones who had it so easy are the same ones who pulled the ladder up and hired the quants and decided to stop taking regular guys off the streets.
It's fucking madness. |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 3:27 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator Are those guys still working in banks? Surely at some point they get shown the door because they are incompetent. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37119008) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 2:17 PM Author: dark cruise ship So genuinely intellectually talented people get the jobs instead? This doesn't seem like a problem. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32662055) |
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Date: February 21st, 2017 7:23 AM Author: Pontificating cyan gunner partner (JJC Alert) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32667120) |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 3:36 PM Author: spectacular lavender round eye (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37119067) |
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Date: March 26th, 2019 11:16 AM Author: Canary flirting station gay wizard (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37992573) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:38 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator GS has 32,000 people. Will that shrink due to gains in efficiency from technology? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32660999) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:44 AM Author: Crusty white property karate inshallah (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32661036) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:45 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator How come trading is there a career path in banking if there are almost no traders left?
http://news.efinancialcareers.com/no-en/careers-in-finance/219878/sales-and-trading-careers |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:52 AM Author: Pontificating cyan gunner partner That article is talking about prop trading which is kind of its own thing, and really isn't what OP was talking about
There's a difference between a sales trader and a prop trader, a sales trader is calling other institutions and moving stuff out of the firms inventory to generate commission revenues.
A proprietary trader is using capital of the firm to make money. There is a big difference between making comissions and making money. The comission making business is the one that has shrunk massively. |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 2:13 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator Article seems to indicate that sales trading is still a career track? (albeit for high end clients) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32662028) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:47 AM Author: Trip institution goldman took good care of the other 598 right? cause they 're a family? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32661052) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:50 AM Author: Crimson medicated location what do these guys do now? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32661065) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 11:53 AM Author: dark cruise ship Trade other products for banks or work at hedge funds pretending to generate alpha (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32661082) |
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Date: February 20th, 2017 2:15 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator How come traders haven't been eliminated from other products? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#32662047) |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 3:38 PM Author: grizzly state stock car cause stocks are basically all the same. 1 share of Microsoft issued in 2002 is the same as a share they issued in 2017. compared to bonds which all have different coupons, maturity dates, other terms, etc. that expire after a set time period + other products are niche and expensive, so you'd want a trader to handle your hedge fund's $200 million MBS swap trade (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37119075) |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 3:41 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator has automation eliminated some niche sales trading jobs even if not 99% like in stocks? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37119093) |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 6:13 PM Author: grizzly state stock car sales is different. sales = manflirting with HF managers to get them to route orders for whatever they want to invest in through you/having a relationship with them if you want to dump assets (which banks have to do now within a certain period of time to not violate regulatiosn against prop trading). plenty sales jobs in equities, you're just selling your company's computer trading platform fundamentally
traders - the people who actually do the trading and sit on books of stocks and assets they own and buy/sell to make markets in - are the ones who are done here in equities. still plenty of those in markets for opaque/not liquid/complex products like derivatives, swaps, MBSes, etc. |
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Date: October 30th, 2018 1:11 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator tyft (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37123123) |
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Date: June 26th, 2018 9:40 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#36311059) |
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Date: October 29th, 2018 4:14 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37119350) |
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Date: October 30th, 2018 8:53 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37124041) |
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Date: March 25th, 2019 12:19 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37986689) |
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Date: March 26th, 2019 11:09 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator All that stuff said in this thread about blockchain 2 years ago turned out to be hype? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#37992529) |
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Date: May 20th, 2019 2:42 PM Author: high-end chapel Not at all. Banks are obliterating jobs across all these areas still. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38261769) |
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Date: May 20th, 2019 2:44 PM Author: high-end chapel I will post links when I get home. Suffice to say that like 20-30% of bank jobs wont exist soon. We lose whole % every year across the industry. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38261777) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 2:39 PM Author: cerebral gay native You're right about banks finding ways to automate processes to reduce headcount but it's not because of blockchain as you argued above two years ago. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38272557) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 2:49 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator How big have been the reductions? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38272620) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 3:38 PM Author: cerebral gay native There are articles all over the place about it (including future plans to reduce big banking's headcount). That part of Are Reptile's screed is accurate.
https://www.americanbanker.com/articles/after-cutting-802-000-jobs-some-big-banks-are-adding-staff
https://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/business/banking/article64138397.html
edit: BoA reduced headcount by 25% since 2008* and is continuing to reduce. *That's not including additional headcount from mergers with countrywide and merrill. Including those, BoA is about the same size as in 2008, but from an industry-wide perspective, that's a huge reduction. |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 4:03 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator I read through the first two links: link 1 is mainly about cuts in investment banking because business has shrunk since 2008 (hard to believe that the 2008 crisis still affects investment banking).
The other seems to refer to the disappearance of tellers at retail branches.
I thought reptile was referring to jobs related to the infrastructure that makes transactions possible. Neither link on cutbacks seems to directly apply to that part of banking. |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 2:52 PM Author: fragrant narrow-minded garrison rigor looks like he never made it home. sad. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38272639) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 3:25 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38272812) |
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Date: May 20th, 2019 2:52 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator I haven't heard anything about this...still skeptical (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38261812) |
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Date: March 31st, 2019 8:14 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38021617) |
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Date: May 20th, 2019 2:33 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38261722) |
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Date: May 20th, 2019 2:47 PM Author: fragrant narrow-minded garrison rigor what does "U.S. cash equities" mean? how does one trade them? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38261787) |
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Date: May 20th, 2019 2:58 PM Author: wonderful goal in life Why is the NYSE still so full of people "trading?" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38261834) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 2:44 PM Author: glittery shimmering quadroon trailer park It's not. It's mostly empty and is mainly used as a TV set. All the remaining traders cluster in one area that they show on TV. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38272579) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 2:49 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator Why didn't it happen sooner? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38272617) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2019 1:58 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38272317) |
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Date: May 27th, 2019 12:37 PM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38295905) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2019 11:36 AM Author: talented marketing idea masturbator (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3531419&forum_id=2#38327850) |