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Biglaw to litigation boutique -- any reason I shouldn't take the leap?

The move I'm considering is from biglaw to a litigation bout...
...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.
  03/19/17
most lit boutiques are midlaw shitholes. the "lit bouti...
David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion
  03/19/17
Plus, they may have work today and in a year they may have n...
ARE Reptile
  03/19/17
if the firm has been around for a while, i'd be more worried...
David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion
  03/19/17
i thought "lit boutique" referred to fairly elite ...
.,.,...,..,.,..:,,:,..,,.;:,,..,:,.;.:..:.,:,::,.
  03/19/17
...
David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion
  03/19/17
Ok, fine, drop the "lit boutique" label and just c...
...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.
  03/19/17
that could very well be higher-stakes shitlaw, breh. do ...
David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion
  03/19/17
I know an assistant GC who worked with them and likes them, ...
...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.
  03/19/17
he doesnt know what it's like to work there and if the partn...
David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion
  03/19/17
That's the one problem... I've found very few former associa...
...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.
  03/19/17
do whatever you can to talk to them -- call them up on monda...
David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion
  03/19/17
...
Dickey Simpkins
  03/19/17
It is common for these to be sweatshops, whether prestigious...
Relapse offender
  03/19/17
I'm just thinking it'd be weird for each person I interviewe...
...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.
  03/19/17
you're in biglaw. you already know lawyers are delusional an...
David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion
  03/19/17
DAT | BALANCE
Elba, Idris
  03/19/17
...
David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion
  03/19/17
So true. What the fuck is wrong with these people.
Poast Malone
  03/19/17
How many hours are you billing now? How much are you on call...
..............;...................
  03/19/17
I'm on call all the time, and I billed ~2400 hours last year...
...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.
  03/19/17
Run
..............;...................
  03/19/17
I went from biglaw to a boutique shop. Built solid relations...
[_____Sign Here____]
  03/19/17
I did this and it turned out terribly
CorporateWarrior With Attitude (CWA)
  03/19/17
How so? What went wrong?
...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.
  03/19/17
I made less, worked more, and worked with some severely psyc...
CorporateWarrior With Attitude (CWA)
  03/19/17
God damn.
LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster
  03/19/17
Working the same or more for less compensation usually works...
Fat Plodding Law Beaver
  03/19/17
...
Ciroc Obama
  03/19/17
Any reason? Yeah, it's litigation.
90s | obese | jamaal
  03/19/17
This is anecdotal. A guy I used to work with left for a bout...
LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster
  03/19/17
One more thing - these guys don't have to go to OCI every ye...
LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster
  03/19/17
...
LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster
  03/19/17
...
LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster
  03/19/17
I'm sure your biglaw is terrible but if you are going to som...
Jordan Belfort
  03/19/17
Lit is a soul crushing waste of time. Doing it for less mon...
The Wilt Chamberlain of DC Brunch Shrews-joeybank
  03/19/17
Not to pile on but I also went from biglaw to midlaw and had...
........,,,...,,,..,,,...,........,,.,
  03/19/17
i was a a summer associate at a lit boutique, and I was shoc...
.,.,...,..,.,.,:,,:,...,:::..,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.::,.
  03/19/17


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 12:44 PM
Author: ...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.


The move I'm considering is from biglaw to a litigation boutique. Both are in the same major metropolitan legal market. I'm not going to give further details, but basically it's a pretty significant pay/prestige reduction in exchange for a sane life. I don't need the money. Anyone have any thoughts on this decision? If you tried to do the same thing, have any advice or stories to tell?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865737)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 12:47 PM
Author: David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion (*)

most lit boutiques are midlaw shitholes. the "lit boutique" name is largely flame.

are you SURE your hours will be better? lots of "lit boutiques" make it much harder to bill than in biglaw. you cant pad as much, partners force you to write down your time, more unbillable shitwork, etc.

find out from reliable sources whether the hours are really better.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865756)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 12:50 PM
Author: ARE Reptile

Plus, they may have work today and in a year they may have nothing and you're out the door. Every firm is shit. Expecting better hours is expecting too much.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865781)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 12:51 PM
Author: David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion (*)

if the firm has been around for a while, i'd be more worried about the opposite problem -- people leave and they dont hire enough and you get swamped w work.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865801)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 12:49 PM
Author: .,.,...,..,.,..:,,:,..,,.;:,,..,:,.;.:..:.,:,::,.


i thought "lit boutique" referred to fairly elite shops.

prestige reduction/pay reduction sounds like you're just headed to some shithole.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865772)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 12:51 PM
Author: David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion (*)



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865792)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 1:09 PM
Author: ...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.


Ok, fine, drop the "lit boutique" label and just call it a small law shop that does commercial litigation in the $10-30 mil range mainly for a mix of Fortune 500 clients and professional firms. This is based on my research of their cases.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865961)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 1:11 PM
Author: David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion (*)

that could very well be higher-stakes shitlaw, breh.

do you know anyone at the firm?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865983)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 1:18 PM
Author: ...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.


I know an assistant GC who worked with them and likes them, saying they're basically nice, smart, and honest. He didn't have the impression they were burning the midnight oil often, though obviously he doesn't have direct knowledge.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32866038)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 1:20 PM
Author: David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion (*)

he doesnt know what it's like to work there and if the partners are assholes. plenty of partners are nice to the outside world but treat their assocs like shit.

do more homework. can you find former associates and ask them?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32866063)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 2:13 PM
Author: ...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.


That's the one problem... I've found very few former associates, and I'm having trouble getting the ones I found to respond. One is now in an Of Counsel position in biglaw, and two appear to have left the law (one started a sort of reg consulting business, the other is doing a non-profit thing). It might be that they don't hire a lot, and the people they hire tend to stay there. Either that, or the former associates don't bother having a LinkedIn.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32866546)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 3:40 PM
Author: David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion (*)

do whatever you can to talk to them -- call them up on monday. former associates are the only reliable source of info if you dont know someone at the firm.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32867202)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 3:56 PM
Author: Dickey Simpkins



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32867348)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 1:14 PM
Author: Relapse offender

It is common for these to be sweatshops, whether prestigious or not, so be very careful. And shit can do downhill fast since there is no real fat compared to biglaw. Collections start suffering a bit and the firm (partners) feel it immediately and start wondering whether you're worth it.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32865999)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 1:22 PM
Author: ...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.


I'm just thinking it'd be weird for each person I interviewed with to talk about their kids and tell me how the firm is great if you have kids. I told them I was planning on having kids within the next five years, and they didn't bat an eye and gave me an offer anyway.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32866083)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 3:52 PM
Author: David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion (*)

you're in biglaw. you already know lawyers are delusional and sociopathic.

"how the firm is great if you have kids" could = "you can come home for dinner, and then work at home until 3am after your kids are in bed"

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32867313)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 7:39 PM
Author: Elba, Idris (MAKE WAKANDA GREAT AGAIN)

DAT | BALANCE

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869053)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 9:20 PM
Author: David Ben Federer, 25 Time Majors+ Champion (*)



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869773)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 8:05 PM
Author: Poast Malone

So true. What the fuck is wrong with these people.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869235)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 1:19 PM
Author: ..............;...................


How many hours are you billing now? How much are you on call? These are the only relevant questions. Nothing else matters.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32866047)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 1:27 PM
Author: ...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.


I'm on call all the time, and I billed ~2400 hours last year, plus I had a ton a non-billable firm stuff. I just have a feeling the main reason my current firm likes me is because I'm their workhorse ... sooner or later I'll keel over and die, and then my carcass will be sent to the glue factory.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32866122)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 2:00 PM
Author: ..............;...................


Run

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32866438)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 2:20 PM
Author: [_____Sign Here____]

I went from biglaw to a boutique shop. Built solid relationships with them and enjoyed my time there. There were times when the hours were lean, but it worked out in the end. We catered to smaller clients that couldn't afford biglaw fees or were not getting the svc they wanted.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32866595)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 3:58 PM
Author: CorporateWarrior With Attitude (CWA)

I did this and it turned out terribly

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32867365)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 4:17 PM
Author: ...;.;.;...;.;.;.;...;.;.;.


How so? What went wrong?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32867528)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 8:02 PM
Author: CorporateWarrior With Attitude (CWA)

I made less, worked more, and worked with some severely psychotic partners. One time I stayed there til 6 am working on some BS brief, went home and showered, came back at 8 am, and was told by the psycho on THAT DAY that he didn't think I was working enough.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869209)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 8:02 PM
Author: LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster


God damn.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869216)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 3:59 PM
Author: Fat Plodding Law Beaver (Veteran of the Psychic Wars)

Working the same or more for less compensation usually works out great. I bet your new firm bio will include some fun and quirky information about how you like to make time to get away to Spain whenever you can.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32867368)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 7:40 PM
Author: Ciroc Obama (autist-in-residence)



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869057)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 7:52 PM
Author: 90s | obese | jamaal

Any reason? Yeah, it's litigation.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869135)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 7:56 PM
Author: LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster


This is anecdotal. A guy I used to work with left for a boutique. Called me a year later to get me to move over and he told me the training is better. The client contact is better and the teams are leaner so the early experience is better. 3 or 4 years after that he came back to our firm. Turns out the flip side of all that lean teams and early experience was 3000 hour years. He also told me that, other than one year when the firm rang the bell with a big plaintiff side win and everyone got a huge bonus, the pay was always less than he had made before he left biglaw.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869161)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 8:04 PM
Author: LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster


One more thing - these guys don't have to go to OCI every year and worry about what Above the law and other blogs said about working there. It's a totally different business model. As a result, their only motive is to work you to death so they can pocket more. People shit talk about biglaw. My biglaw gig is a walk in the fucking park compared to my previous midlaw gig.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869231)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 9:20 PM
Author: LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster




(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869771)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 9:50 PM
Author: LongTimeLurker1stTimePoaster




(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32869995)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 10:20 PM
Author: Jordan Belfort

I'm sure your biglaw is terrible but if you are going to some firm that has 10-15 partners and you are going to be one of their only associates you might be in for a world of pain. There's nowhere to hide when you have to be everyone's go-to guy and there are no other associates or paralegals to dump work on.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32870187)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 10:33 PM
Author: The Wilt Chamberlain of DC Brunch Shrews-joeybank

Lit is a soul crushing waste of time. Doing it for less money is a mistake. The grass is dark brown everywhere.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32870277)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 10:36 PM
Author: ........,,,...,,,..,,,...,........,,.,


Not to pile on but I also went from biglaw to midlaw and had a terrible experience that caused me to return to biglaw. I ended up dealing with douchebag partners who made me basically do 90% of their practices for them and who in return treated me like shit. The lack of professionalism was also galling. For example I did nearly all of the work on one matter - with a couple very late nights when the partner over-promised and then dumped stuff on me at the last minute - and then when I saw the invoice I caught him writing off ~50% of my time and crediting a ton of hours to him while he was barely involved. Crazy shit. I made it a year and ran back to biglaw and I fucking hate biglaw.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32870307)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2017 11:09 PM
Author: .,.,...,..,.,.,:,,:,...,:::..,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.::,.


i was a a summer associate at a lit boutique, and I was shocked when i saw that a partner had billed a flat 15 hours every single weekday. he wasn't on trial and i had eaten a long lunch with him one of those days. i seriously thought he was committing fraud.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3557755&forum_id=2#32870579)