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Cell phone company offered me 400k to build an antenna on my property

30 year lease and they get an easement. Ljl when it rains it...
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
Ask for 1m
contagious maize nursing home
  03/23/17
Honestly i'd let them do it for 10k i get no service here no...
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
You need to price this out. A cell phone antenna attachment...
Burgundy Trip Feces Yarmulke
  03/23/17
Seriously?
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
hero
Wonderful Arrogant Philosopher-king Theater
  03/23/17
"Look at the value of $3,500 per month for 30 years, di...
Soggy glittery stag film
  03/23/17
Good question
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
Why are you assuming the cash flow won't grow? Need to know ...
Topaz ungodly dopamine hunting ground
  03/23/17
Why would I assume otherwise?
Soggy glittery stag film
  03/23/17
So you are asking him to ask for the entire present value of...
pearl thriller theater stage
  03/23/17
Enjoy brain cancer.
pearl thriller theater stage
  03/23/17
...
Sick locus filthpig
  03/23/17
He's gonna live forever.
odious property dog poop
  03/23/17
...
Ivory Angry Space Reading Party
  03/23/17
...
Vivacious lavender nibblets stage
  03/23/17
...
Frozen idiot
  03/24/17
Libs losing hoap
Milky soul-stirring famous landscape painting
  03/23/17
Enjoy ur cancer
Dark Adventurous Menage
  03/23/17
Thats flame, plus it will be up on a hill a ways away from a...
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
Demand 800k
Supple Half-breed Set
  03/23/17
...
bisexual house dragon
  03/23/17
...
scarlet aromatic quadroon
  03/24/17
Woah Cr Friend!
provocative university
  03/23/17
half cash, half coke
Onyx exciting box office becky
  03/23/17
...
excitant sooty cumskin macaca
  03/23/17
...
odious property dog poop
  03/23/17
...
copper awkward toilet seat
  03/23/17
Demand a clause that you get to fuck around on the antenna a...
avocado spectacular sweet tailpipe abode
  03/23/17
Yeah. Climbing it is FUN. BOUNCY! BOUNCY! BOUNCY!
pearl thriller theater stage
  03/23/17
I wonder it i could tap into their bandwidth
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
(kindergarten cop kid)
Onyx exciting box office becky
  03/23/17
Free upgrades for life!
razzle-dazzle generalized bond
  03/23/17
Many, many people who do this ultimately regret it. At th...
Green spot
  03/23/17
this is correct. it costs about $75,000 in 2017 dollars to r...
fear-inspiring bull headed ceo
  03/23/17
why would you want to remove the tower? Can rig it for your ...
Appetizing amber locale
  03/23/17
Because (a) it sounds like it's no where near a road, (b) in...
Green spot
  03/23/17
"They arent going to give you permission to put a giant...
Stirring water buffalo
  03/23/17
...
spruce gaped gay wizard
  03/24/17
Huge Christmas tree.
Soggy glittery stag film
  03/24/17
Best tree house ever.
Soggy glittery stag film
  03/24/17
Oh and if you ever want to subdivide and sell you have a gia...
Green spot
  03/23/17
that's not how it works, dude. you discount the future co...
passionate dilemma cuckoldry
  03/23/17
i have a lot of land so its not really a worry. This would b...
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
ask for 20,000 ETH instead
Mint knife
  03/23/17
C A N C E R clause dude: seriously, demand something re: can...
Violent office
  03/23/17
lol at anyone telling him to demand anything. he doesn't own...
fear-inspiring bull headed ceo
  03/23/17
MAKE | GOOD | DEALS they'll reject so then say FMV in ...
grizzly stimulating gas station elastic band
  03/23/17
no they won't. they'll just make their offer to a different ...
fear-inspiring bull headed ceo
  03/23/17
well this presumes there's not someone immediately next door...
grizzly stimulating gas station elastic band
  03/23/17
there's about one cell tower every square half mile in a den...
fear-inspiring bull headed ceo
  03/23/17
not doing subthread wasteland here, aspie, I think u get my ...
grizzly stimulating gas station elastic band
  03/23/17
Ask for more Demand more for every co-tenant Get a decent ...
cheese-eating market
  03/23/17
And they give him Boost Mobile FOR LIFE.
Soggy glittery stag film
  03/23/17
With unlimited data.
cheese-eating market
  03/23/17
LJL. I've handled some of these deals. The cell company in...
dashing bearded partner wagecucks
  03/23/17
great advice. worth $10ks im sure.
passionate dilemma cuckoldry
  03/23/17
Sounds like he also has to get the other side to cover his l...
Yellow center voyeur
  03/23/17
of course.
dashing bearded partner wagecucks
  03/23/17
I imagine this is all boilerplate stuff they do these all th...
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
you imagine wrong. they usually try to pay out a fixed sum,...
dashing bearded partner wagecucks
  03/23/17
Crazy, good to know
Violent Umber Den
  03/23/17
I helped somebody do one of these once. Lease was like 30 pa...
cheese-eating market
  03/23/17
In a few of the ones I've done the provisions aren't boilerp...
Green spot
  03/23/17
also they don't include repair and takeaway costs, so when t...
Fragrant stubborn point liquid oxygen
  03/23/17
lol @ assuming kindness and decency from a corporation
passionate dilemma cuckoldry
  03/24/17
Woah Cr friend!
scarlet aromatic quadroon
  03/24/17
If you play hardball, they will go next door. Now you have a...
Frozen idiot
  03/24/17


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:50 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

30 year lease and they get an easement. Ljl when it rains it pours

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898824)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:52 PM
Author: contagious maize nursing home

Ask for 1m

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898841)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:53 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

Honestly i'd let them do it for 10k i get no service here now, plus they will run fiber to it

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898846)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:01 PM
Author: Burgundy Trip Feces Yarmulke

You need to price this out. A cell phone antenna attachment pays rent of about $700 per month to be on a tower. Each carrier will want an attachment on the tower, so you typically will see 4-5 attachments per tower. Look at the value of $3,500 per month for 30 years, discounted to present value. That's how much you should be asking for.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898917)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:03 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

Seriously?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898926)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:04 PM
Author: Wonderful Arrogant Philosopher-king Theater

hero

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898935)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:46 PM
Author: Soggy glittery stag film

"Look at the value of $3,500 per month for 30 years, discounted to present value."

Given bankruptcy and enforcement risk, I judge this a mildly risky investment and apply a 10% discount, valuing the $3,500 cash flow at about $420,000.

What's the tax treatment for $3,500 monthly payments? Ordinary income would be TTT.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899191)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:51 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

Good question

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899230)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:29 PM
Author: Topaz ungodly dopamine hunting ground

Why are you assuming the cash flow won't grow? Need to know the term of $700/month leases.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900066)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:30 PM
Author: Soggy glittery stag film

Why would I assume otherwise?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901775)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:53 PM
Author: pearl thriller theater stage

So you are asking him to ask for the entire present value of what the tower company will make?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899247)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:49 PM
Author: pearl thriller theater stage

Enjoy brain cancer.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899225)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 4:08 PM
Author: Sick locus filthpig



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899363)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:32 PM
Author: odious property dog poop

He's gonna live forever.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901790)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:57 PM
Author: Ivory Angry Space Reading Party



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902057)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 10:57 PM
Author: Vivacious lavender nibblets stage



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32903135)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 10:04 AM
Author: Frozen idiot



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32905312)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:54 PM
Author: Milky soul-stirring famous landscape painting

Libs losing hoap

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898850)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:55 PM
Author: Dark Adventurous Menage

Enjoy ur cancer

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898852)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:55 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

Thats flame, plus it will be up on a hill a ways away from anything

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898859)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:55 PM
Author: Supple Half-breed Set

Demand 800k

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898853)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:02 PM
Author: bisexual house dragon



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898924)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 2:50 AM
Author: scarlet aromatic quadroon



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32904338)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:57 PM
Author: provocative university

Woah Cr Friend!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898879)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:57 PM
Author: Onyx exciting box office becky

half cash, half coke

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898881)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:58 PM
Author: excitant sooty cumskin macaca



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898891)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:33 PM
Author: odious property dog poop



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901792)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:03 PM
Author: copper awkward toilet seat



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898928)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:55 PM
Author: avocado spectacular sweet tailpipe abode

Demand a clause that you get to fuck around on the antenna as much as you like.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899264)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:57 PM
Author: pearl thriller theater stage

Yeah. Climbing it is FUN. BOUNCY! BOUNCY! BOUNCY!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899281)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 4:03 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

I wonder it i could tap into their bandwidth

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899320)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 4:18 PM
Author: Onyx exciting box office becky

(kindergarten cop kid)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899432)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 4:16 PM
Author: razzle-dazzle generalized bond

Free upgrades for life!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899413)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:22 PM
Author: Green spot

Many, many people who do this ultimately regret it.

At the end of the lease do they have to repair the property? They like to leave the foundation and footings in the ground which can be very expensive to remove. I've even heard tower guys say over a few drinks that they sometimes try to sneak it in that they have no obligation to even remove the tower. After 30 years it's likely obsolete or nearing the end of its useful life anyway.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899996)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:28 PM
Author: fear-inspiring bull headed ceo

this is correct. it costs about $75,000 in 2017 dollars to remove a full tower and the foundation. factor in inflation over 30 years and you're basically paying them for the tower.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900062)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:34 PM
Author: Appetizing amber locale

why would you want to remove the tower? Can rig it for your own use or sell billboards on that shit

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900121)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:39 PM
Author: Green spot

Because (a) it sounds like it's no where near a road, (b) in many jurisdictions billboards are almost as highly regulated as strip clubs. They arent going to give you permission to put a giant fucking sign on a jury rigged rusting out cell phone tower and (c) the sign company isn't going to want to put a valuable giant sign on a jury rigged rusting out cell phone tower.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900198)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:53 PM
Author: Stirring water buffalo

"They arent going to give you permission to put a giant fucking sign on a jury rigged rusting out cell phone tower and (c) the sign company isn't going to want to put a valuable giant sign on a jury rigged rusting out cell phone tower. "

this made me chortle out loud in my office. ty

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900347)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 10:13 AM
Author: spruce gaped gay wizard



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32905360)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 2:48 AM
Author: Soggy glittery stag film

Huge Christmas tree.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32904335)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 2:54 AM
Author: Soggy glittery stag film

Best tree house ever.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32904343)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:42 PM
Author: Green spot

Oh and if you ever want to subdivide and sell you have a giant fuckkng tower to deal with as well as some prole cunt who thinks she's going to get cancer.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900237)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:39 PM
Author: passionate dilemma cuckoldry

that's not how it works, dude.

you discount the future cost to the present.

let's say the real discount rate is 1%. that means the present value of the cost of tearing it down after 30 years is $56K or so.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901861)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:52 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

i have a lot of land so its not really a worry. This would be in an area i check once a year or so

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900332)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:30 PM
Author: Mint knife

ask for 20,000 ETH instead

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900082)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:31 PM
Author: Violent office

C A N C E R clause dude: seriously, demand something re: cancer

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900093)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:33 PM
Author: fear-inspiring bull headed ceo

lol at anyone telling him to demand anything. he doesn't own all the land in the world

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900108)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:34 PM
Author: grizzly stimulating gas station elastic band

MAKE | GOOD | DEALS

they'll reject

so then say FMV in your estimate is higher than what offered, get a few extra bucks out of them

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900124)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:36 PM
Author: fear-inspiring bull headed ceo

no they won't. they'll just make their offer to a different guy down the road and hope he's dumber and more prole/short-sighted

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900141)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:36 PM
Author: grizzly stimulating gas station elastic band

well this presumes there's not someone immediately next door, obviously

think of it like oil drilling

there's a reason they pick parcel A or B

but yeah if this guy has someone next door I might not be a HARDBALLER

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900151)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:39 PM
Author: fear-inspiring bull headed ceo

there's about one cell tower every square half mile in a densely populated area. do you know how many acres that is?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900193)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:39 PM
Author: grizzly stimulating gas station elastic band

not doing subthread wasteland here, aspie, I think u get my point and I certainly acknowledge with the facts on your side, it would make sense to take the offer



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900200)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:26 PM
Author: cheese-eating market

Ask for more

Demand more for every co-tenant

Get a decent inflation rate increase every 5 years

They pay increased property tax

Check with your homeowners. They pay if you need a rider

They pay to restore the grounds to like new condition

They indemnify and have duty to defend any administrative actions (zoning, environmental, etc.)

They indemnify and have duty to defend any civil actions

They maintain access road

Probably more I'm not thinking of. Better check with a realtor, ask how it affects resale value.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901748)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:32 PM
Author: Soggy glittery stag film

And they give him Boost Mobile FOR LIFE.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901784)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:35 PM
Author: cheese-eating market

With unlimited data.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901825)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:34 PM
Author: dashing bearded partner wagecucks

LJL. I've handled some of these deals. The cell company invariably ends up fucking the property owner.

OP, if you decide to do it, negotiate the actual cost of utilities, recalculated every X months, as an addition to any rents, and make the cell company install and use a separate meter (better) or third-party submeter (worse) for their power usage. You don't want them on your meter if you can help it - they run up your KW draw as well as your kWh usage. If you don't understand the difference, you need to do more research before you sign anything. Include utilities taxes, fees, etc as part of the deal. Also, make them pay for all maintenance, indemnify you for any damage, repair, environmental issues, noise, etc., and include a termination clause you can execute. A five-year lease with renewal options is probably better than 30 years. Then promptly stay on top of that shit and evict them the second things go sour - you can usually renegotiate for better terms at the threat of a UD suit.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901812)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:41 PM
Author: passionate dilemma cuckoldry

great advice. worth $10ks im sure.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901887)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:43 PM
Author: Yellow center voyeur

Sounds like he also has to get the other side to cover his legal fees

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901920)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:02 PM
Author: dashing bearded partner wagecucks

of course.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902100)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:03 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

I imagine this is all boilerplate stuff they do these all the time, of couse they pay utilities etc

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902112)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:03 PM
Author: dashing bearded partner wagecucks

you imagine wrong. they usually try to pay out a fixed sum, or a fixed monthly utilities payment when the actual utilities costs increase regularly.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902120)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:04 PM
Author: Violent Umber Den

Crazy, good to know

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902129)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:41 PM
Author: cheese-eating market

I helped somebody do one of these once. Lease was like 30 pages, and had none of the stuff I listed above or that mccheese is talking about. U have to ask for all of it, their boilerplate lease is one sided as fuck.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902470)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 11:26 PM
Author: Green spot

In a few of the ones I've done the provisions aren't boilerplate per de but are one sided and unless you have a good industry knowledgeable attorney push hard for you they'll say they can't change the majority of it because "bullshit, bullshit and bullshit". They can and do change them.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32903368)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 11:29 PM
Author: Fragrant stubborn point liquid oxygen

also they don't include repair and takeaway costs, so when they finish with the tower or it breaks in a storm, they just abandon it and the land owner is left with worthless shit on his property that costs a fuckton to remove

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32903386)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 10:07 AM
Author: passionate dilemma cuckoldry

lol @ assuming kindness and decency from a corporation

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32905329)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 2:51 AM
Author: scarlet aromatic quadroon

Woah Cr friend!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32904339)



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Date: March 24th, 2017 10:07 AM
Author: Frozen idiot

If you play hardball, they will go next door. Now you have a giant cell tower next door (and thus cancer) but no 400k.

All in all, YOUR fucked.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32905328)