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Cell phone company offered me 400k to build an antenna on my property

30 year lease and they get an easement. Ljl when it rains it...
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
Ask for 1m
pea-brained alcoholic black woman
  03/23/17
Honestly i'd let them do it for 10k i get no service here no...
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
You need to price this out. A cell phone antenna attachment...
Vibrant Stead
  03/23/17
Seriously?
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
hero
Chartreuse Market
  03/23/17
"Look at the value of $3,500 per month for 30 years, di...
180 state
  03/23/17
Good question
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
Why are you assuming the cash flow won't grow? Need to know ...
Dun heaven
  03/23/17
Why would I assume otherwise?
180 state
  03/23/17
So you are asking him to ask for the entire present value of...
pale half-breed
  03/23/17
Enjoy brain cancer.
pale half-breed
  03/23/17
...
Claret Thriller Library
  03/23/17
He's gonna live forever.
House-broken Garrison
  03/23/17
...
Painfully Honest Spot Kitty Cat
  03/23/17
...
Vivacious Codepig
  03/23/17
...
Umber selfie
  03/24/17
Libs losing hoap
Flesh Yapping Useless Brakes
  03/23/17
Enjoy ur cancer
Disturbing offensive plaza puppy
  03/23/17
Thats flame, plus it will be up on a hill a ways away from a...
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
Demand 800k
translucent mother
  03/23/17
...
lemon theater haunted graveyard
  03/23/17
...
mischievous cruise ship
  03/24/17
Woah Cr Friend!
wine hell
  03/23/17
half cash, half coke
insecure azure house
  03/23/17
...
Frum marketing idea toaster
  03/23/17
...
House-broken Garrison
  03/23/17
...
rambunctious water buffalo french chef
  03/23/17
Demand a clause that you get to fuck around on the antenna a...
galvanic macaca
  03/23/17
Yeah. Climbing it is FUN. BOUNCY! BOUNCY! BOUNCY!
pale half-breed
  03/23/17
I wonder it i could tap into their bandwidth
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
(kindergarten cop kid)
insecure azure house
  03/23/17
Free upgrades for life!
Hairraiser Drunken Hospital Preventive Strike
  03/23/17
Many, many people who do this ultimately regret it. At th...
Aphrodisiac ticket booth corn cake
  03/23/17
this is correct. it costs about $75,000 in 2017 dollars to r...
supple sticky stage
  03/23/17
why would you want to remove the tower? Can rig it for your ...
elite crackhouse antidepressant drug
  03/23/17
Because (a) it sounds like it's no where near a road, (b) in...
Aphrodisiac ticket booth corn cake
  03/23/17
"They arent going to give you permission to put a giant...
spectacular whorehouse
  03/23/17
...
Iridescent Haunting School
  03/24/17
Huge Christmas tree.
180 state
  03/24/17
Best tree house ever.
180 state
  03/24/17
Oh and if you ever want to subdivide and sell you have a gia...
Aphrodisiac ticket booth corn cake
  03/23/17
that's not how it works, dude. you discount the future co...
Big persian site
  03/23/17
i have a lot of land so its not really a worry. This would b...
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
ask for 20,000 ETH instead
Vigorous Very Tactful Nursing Home
  03/23/17
C A N C E R clause dude: seriously, demand something re: can...
fear-inspiring soul-stirring circlehead
  03/23/17
lol at anyone telling him to demand anything. he doesn't own...
supple sticky stage
  03/23/17
MAKE | GOOD | DEALS they'll reject so then say FMV in ...
Federal rough-skinned electric furnace rigor
  03/23/17
no they won't. they'll just make their offer to a different ...
supple sticky stage
  03/23/17
well this presumes there's not someone immediately next door...
Federal rough-skinned electric furnace rigor
  03/23/17
there's about one cell tower every square half mile in a den...
supple sticky stage
  03/23/17
not doing subthread wasteland here, aspie, I think u get my ...
Federal rough-skinned electric furnace rigor
  03/23/17
Ask for more Demand more for every co-tenant Get a decent ...
Geriatric outnumbered trailer park
  03/23/17
And they give him Boost Mobile FOR LIFE.
180 state
  03/23/17
With unlimited data.
Geriatric outnumbered trailer park
  03/23/17
LJL. I've handled some of these deals. The cell company in...
ungodly tan indian lodge toilet seat
  03/23/17
great advice. worth $10ks im sure.
Big persian site
  03/23/17
Sounds like he also has to get the other side to cover his l...
crusty cumskin party of the first part
  03/23/17
of course.
ungodly tan indian lodge toilet seat
  03/23/17
I imagine this is all boilerplate stuff they do these all th...
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
you imagine wrong. they usually try to pay out a fixed sum,...
ungodly tan indian lodge toilet seat
  03/23/17
Crazy, good to know
stubborn aromatic background story
  03/23/17
I helped somebody do one of these once. Lease was like 30 pa...
Geriatric outnumbered trailer park
  03/23/17
In a few of the ones I've done the provisions aren't boilerp...
Aphrodisiac ticket booth corn cake
  03/23/17
also they don't include repair and takeaway costs, so when t...
aquamarine bat shit crazy yarmulke pit
  03/23/17
lol @ assuming kindness and decency from a corporation
Big persian site
  03/24/17
Woah Cr friend!
mischievous cruise ship
  03/24/17
If you play hardball, they will go next door. Now you have a...
Umber selfie
  03/24/17


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:50 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

30 year lease and they get an easement. Ljl when it rains it pours

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898824)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:52 PM
Author: pea-brained alcoholic black woman

Ask for 1m

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898841)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:53 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

Honestly i'd let them do it for 10k i get no service here now, plus they will run fiber to it

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898846)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:01 PM
Author: Vibrant Stead

You need to price this out. A cell phone antenna attachment pays rent of about $700 per month to be on a tower. Each carrier will want an attachment on the tower, so you typically will see 4-5 attachments per tower. Look at the value of $3,500 per month for 30 years, discounted to present value. That's how much you should be asking for.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898917)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:03 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

Seriously?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898926)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:04 PM
Author: Chartreuse Market

hero

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898935)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:46 PM
Author: 180 state

"Look at the value of $3,500 per month for 30 years, discounted to present value."

Given bankruptcy and enforcement risk, I judge this a mildly risky investment and apply a 10% discount, valuing the $3,500 cash flow at about $420,000.

What's the tax treatment for $3,500 monthly payments? Ordinary income would be TTT.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899191)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:51 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

Good question

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899230)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:29 PM
Author: Dun heaven

Why are you assuming the cash flow won't grow? Need to know the term of $700/month leases.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900066)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:30 PM
Author: 180 state

Why would I assume otherwise?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901775)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:53 PM
Author: pale half-breed

So you are asking him to ask for the entire present value of what the tower company will make?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899247)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:49 PM
Author: pale half-breed

Enjoy brain cancer.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899225)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 4:08 PM
Author: Claret Thriller Library



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899363)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:32 PM
Author: House-broken Garrison

He's gonna live forever.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901790)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:57 PM
Author: Painfully Honest Spot Kitty Cat



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902057)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 10:57 PM
Author: Vivacious Codepig



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32903135)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 10:04 AM
Author: Umber selfie



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32905312)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:54 PM
Author: Flesh Yapping Useless Brakes

Libs losing hoap

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898850)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:55 PM
Author: Disturbing offensive plaza puppy

Enjoy ur cancer

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898852)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:55 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

Thats flame, plus it will be up on a hill a ways away from anything

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898859)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:55 PM
Author: translucent mother

Demand 800k

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898853)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:02 PM
Author: lemon theater haunted graveyard



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898924)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 2:50 AM
Author: mischievous cruise ship



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32904338)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:57 PM
Author: wine hell

Woah Cr Friend!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898879)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:57 PM
Author: insecure azure house

half cash, half coke

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898881)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 2:58 PM
Author: Frum marketing idea toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898891)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:33 PM
Author: House-broken Garrison



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901792)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:03 PM
Author: rambunctious water buffalo french chef



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32898928)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:55 PM
Author: galvanic macaca

Demand a clause that you get to fuck around on the antenna as much as you like.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899264)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 3:57 PM
Author: pale half-breed

Yeah. Climbing it is FUN. BOUNCY! BOUNCY! BOUNCY!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899281)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 4:03 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

I wonder it i could tap into their bandwidth

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899320)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 4:18 PM
Author: insecure azure house

(kindergarten cop kid)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899432)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 4:16 PM
Author: Hairraiser Drunken Hospital Preventive Strike

Free upgrades for life!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899413)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:22 PM
Author: Aphrodisiac ticket booth corn cake

Many, many people who do this ultimately regret it.

At the end of the lease do they have to repair the property? They like to leave the foundation and footings in the ground which can be very expensive to remove. I've even heard tower guys say over a few drinks that they sometimes try to sneak it in that they have no obligation to even remove the tower. After 30 years it's likely obsolete or nearing the end of its useful life anyway.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32899996)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:28 PM
Author: supple sticky stage

this is correct. it costs about $75,000 in 2017 dollars to remove a full tower and the foundation. factor in inflation over 30 years and you're basically paying them for the tower.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900062)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:34 PM
Author: elite crackhouse antidepressant drug

why would you want to remove the tower? Can rig it for your own use or sell billboards on that shit

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900121)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:39 PM
Author: Aphrodisiac ticket booth corn cake

Because (a) it sounds like it's no where near a road, (b) in many jurisdictions billboards are almost as highly regulated as strip clubs. They arent going to give you permission to put a giant fucking sign on a jury rigged rusting out cell phone tower and (c) the sign company isn't going to want to put a valuable giant sign on a jury rigged rusting out cell phone tower.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900198)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:53 PM
Author: spectacular whorehouse

"They arent going to give you permission to put a giant fucking sign on a jury rigged rusting out cell phone tower and (c) the sign company isn't going to want to put a valuable giant sign on a jury rigged rusting out cell phone tower. "

this made me chortle out loud in my office. ty

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900347)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 10:13 AM
Author: Iridescent Haunting School



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32905360)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 2:48 AM
Author: 180 state

Huge Christmas tree.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32904335)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 2:54 AM
Author: 180 state

Best tree house ever.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32904343)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:42 PM
Author: Aphrodisiac ticket booth corn cake

Oh and if you ever want to subdivide and sell you have a giant fuckkng tower to deal with as well as some prole cunt who thinks she's going to get cancer.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900237)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:39 PM
Author: Big persian site

that's not how it works, dude.

you discount the future cost to the present.

let's say the real discount rate is 1%. that means the present value of the cost of tearing it down after 30 years is $56K or so.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901861)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:52 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

i have a lot of land so its not really a worry. This would be in an area i check once a year or so

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900332)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:30 PM
Author: Vigorous Very Tactful Nursing Home

ask for 20,000 ETH instead

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900082)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:31 PM
Author: fear-inspiring soul-stirring circlehead

C A N C E R clause dude: seriously, demand something re: cancer

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900093)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:33 PM
Author: supple sticky stage

lol at anyone telling him to demand anything. he doesn't own all the land in the world

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900108)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:34 PM
Author: Federal rough-skinned electric furnace rigor

MAKE | GOOD | DEALS

they'll reject

so then say FMV in your estimate is higher than what offered, get a few extra bucks out of them

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900124)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:36 PM
Author: supple sticky stage

no they won't. they'll just make their offer to a different guy down the road and hope he's dumber and more prole/short-sighted

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900141)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:36 PM
Author: Federal rough-skinned electric furnace rigor

well this presumes there's not someone immediately next door, obviously

think of it like oil drilling

there's a reason they pick parcel A or B

but yeah if this guy has someone next door I might not be a HARDBALLER

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900151)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:39 PM
Author: supple sticky stage

there's about one cell tower every square half mile in a densely populated area. do you know how many acres that is?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900193)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 5:39 PM
Author: Federal rough-skinned electric furnace rigor

not doing subthread wasteland here, aspie, I think u get my point and I certainly acknowledge with the facts on your side, it would make sense to take the offer



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32900200)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:26 PM
Author: Geriatric outnumbered trailer park

Ask for more

Demand more for every co-tenant

Get a decent inflation rate increase every 5 years

They pay increased property tax

Check with your homeowners. They pay if you need a rider

They pay to restore the grounds to like new condition

They indemnify and have duty to defend any administrative actions (zoning, environmental, etc.)

They indemnify and have duty to defend any civil actions

They maintain access road

Probably more I'm not thinking of. Better check with a realtor, ask how it affects resale value.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901748)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:32 PM
Author: 180 state

And they give him Boost Mobile FOR LIFE.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901784)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:35 PM
Author: Geriatric outnumbered trailer park

With unlimited data.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901825)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:34 PM
Author: ungodly tan indian lodge toilet seat

LJL. I've handled some of these deals. The cell company invariably ends up fucking the property owner.

OP, if you decide to do it, negotiate the actual cost of utilities, recalculated every X months, as an addition to any rents, and make the cell company install and use a separate meter (better) or third-party submeter (worse) for their power usage. You don't want them on your meter if you can help it - they run up your KW draw as well as your kWh usage. If you don't understand the difference, you need to do more research before you sign anything. Include utilities taxes, fees, etc as part of the deal. Also, make them pay for all maintenance, indemnify you for any damage, repair, environmental issues, noise, etc., and include a termination clause you can execute. A five-year lease with renewal options is probably better than 30 years. Then promptly stay on top of that shit and evict them the second things go sour - you can usually renegotiate for better terms at the threat of a UD suit.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901812)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:41 PM
Author: Big persian site

great advice. worth $10ks im sure.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901887)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 8:43 PM
Author: crusty cumskin party of the first part

Sounds like he also has to get the other side to cover his legal fees

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32901920)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:02 PM
Author: ungodly tan indian lodge toilet seat

of course.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902100)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:03 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

I imagine this is all boilerplate stuff they do these all the time, of couse they pay utilities etc

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902112)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:03 PM
Author: ungodly tan indian lodge toilet seat

you imagine wrong. they usually try to pay out a fixed sum, or a fixed monthly utilities payment when the actual utilities costs increase regularly.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902120)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:04 PM
Author: stubborn aromatic background story

Crazy, good to know

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902129)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 9:41 PM
Author: Geriatric outnumbered trailer park

I helped somebody do one of these once. Lease was like 30 pages, and had none of the stuff I listed above or that mccheese is talking about. U have to ask for all of it, their boilerplate lease is one sided as fuck.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32902470)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 11:26 PM
Author: Aphrodisiac ticket booth corn cake

In a few of the ones I've done the provisions aren't boilerplate per de but are one sided and unless you have a good industry knowledgeable attorney push hard for you they'll say they can't change the majority of it because "bullshit, bullshit and bullshit". They can and do change them.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32903368)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 23rd, 2017 11:29 PM
Author: aquamarine bat shit crazy yarmulke pit

also they don't include repair and takeaway costs, so when they finish with the tower or it breaks in a storm, they just abandon it and the land owner is left with worthless shit on his property that costs a fuckton to remove

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32903386)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 10:07 AM
Author: Big persian site

lol @ assuming kindness and decency from a corporation

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32905329)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 2:51 AM
Author: mischievous cruise ship

Woah Cr friend!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32904339)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 24th, 2017 10:07 AM
Author: Umber selfie

If you play hardball, they will go next door. Now you have a giant cell tower next door (and thus cancer) but no 400k.

All in all, YOUR fucked.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3562000&forum_id=2#32905328)