Like many conservatives, I had grave concerns about curtailing the New York City police department’s controversial tactic of stopping and frisking potential suspects for weapons. I was inclined to defer to the police when they protested that they needed the option to stop, question, and frisk New Yorkers on a mere reasonable suspicion of wrongdoing instead of probable cause that the targeted person had committed a crime. Restricting the tactic, I thought, would cause an uptick, maybe even a spike, in crime rates. Mayor Bill de Blasio, who made ending stop-and-frisk the centerpiece of his successful 2013 campaign for mayor, struck me as a man who was cynically willing to tolerate an increase in crime if he thought it to his political advantage to amplify leftist voters’ core belief that policing was out of control.

Today in New York City, use of stop-and-frisk, which the department justified via the 1968 Terry v. Ohio Supreme Court ruling, has crashed. Yet the statistics are clear: Crime is lower than ever. It’s possible that crime would be even lower had stop-and-frisk been retained, but that’s moving the goalposts. I and others argued that crime would rise. Instead, it fell. We were wrong.

Major crime in New York City has continued to decline almost across the board in the four years of the de Blasio administration, to the lowest rates since New York City began keeping extensive records on crime in the early 1960s. Crime is literally off the charts — the low end of the charts. To compare today’s crime rate to even that of ten years ago is to observe a breathtaking decline.

New York City saw a record-low 333 homicides in 2014, the first year of the de Blasio administration. Though that figure was slightly higher in 2015 and 2016 (352 and 335), four of the five least-murderous years in New York City since 1960 have been in the de Blasio era. Other crime statistics have largely followed suit, with the total number of major crimes down in 2017 by about 6 percent since 2016, which was itself a record-low year.

As of December 27, New York City saw 286 homicides in 2017, down 12 percent from the previous year, itself a near-record low. That is a rate of about 3 per 100,000 population. By contrast, Chicago’s homicide rate for 2017 was about 24 per 100,000. The figure for Baltimore is about 56. There were more murder victims in Baltimore than in New York City in 2017, even though New York has nearly 14 times as many residents.

Stop-and-frisk was deployed in New York City some 686,000 times at the peak in 2011, dropped sharply in 2012–2013, the last couple of years of the Mike Bloomberg administration, and plummeted to 12,000 incidents in 2016, according to NYPD data tracked by the New York Civil Liberties Union. That’s about a 98 percent reduction in use of the tactic.

De Blasio is not the primary reason for this reversal; the courts appeared to be on their way to killing stop-and-frisk on Fourth Amendment grounds before he even took office as civil-liberties advocates built a case that the “reasonable suspicion” standard seemed to have devolved into “a hunch is good enough.” So it seems likely that the sharp declines that began under Bloomberg would have continued if Bloomberg had remained in office. Nevertheless, de Blasio was correct in saying the city could withstand a sharp decrease in stop-and-frisk. And he was right to draw attention to the social cost of the practice; more than 80 percent of those subjected to stop-and-frisk since the start of the Bloomberg administration were, according to the NYPD, completely innocent. That means hundreds of thousands of New Yorkers were unjustly subjected to embarrassment or even humiliation.

It’s possible there is some number-fudging going on with the crime statistics, but so far there is only scattered anecdotal evidence of that. And any serious effort to charge today’s cops with distorting the numbers would have to consider whether yesterday’s cops did the same. Moreover, if anything, the de Blasio-era police have been more antagonistic to the mayor than in any previous administration, taking such unprecedented steps as turning their backs to him en masse at a funeral and, at the nadir three years ago, launching a major slowdown in arrests and writing tickets. Police seem disinclined to do de Blasio any favors by giving him favorable crime statistics to brag about.

New York City’s mayor is a contemptible human being who marched in a parade headed by a terrorist, flouted the law in failing to turn over unused school space for high-quality charters that serve as a lifeline out of the slums, and did favors for campaign fundraisers. But as de Blasio begins his second and final term as mayor, having been sworn in by the country’s sole high-ranking socialist, Bernie Sanders, he’s entitled to an I-told-you-so moment on the issue that swept him into office. — Kyle Smith is National Review’s critic-at-large.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/455035/new-york-city-stop-and-frisk-crime-decline-conservatives-wrong

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059145)

Bullshit like stop and frisk hurts conservativism more than any lib could hope to.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059213)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059246)

I can't imagine a single person would vote Republican but for stop and frisk. GOP should proudly fly its law and order flag.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059254)

It's easily the most heavily policed city in America. You cannot go to any major street without seeing some police presence. It's probably gotten MORE heavily policed over the last decade.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059269)

how about we act like we're fit to rule and focus on opposing lib policies *where they are wrong*.

dude what happened, you used to not be an actual racial animus type racist.

edit: I hope, as the guy downthread writes, the extreme Carl Schmitt tone is sarcasm. in which case count me lowIQpwned

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35060362)

War Machine is right in a vacuum. But that's not how politics is played. It's played as war, where Dems never give an inch on anything. Therefore, it's cucky long term suicide to give into the libs on anything.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059239)

But stopping and searching hundreds of innocent people every single day for no good reason? AWESOME! let's stick it to those minor- I mean criminals.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059311)

You have to use your common sense. Police target a very small group of people who overwhelmingly are disproportionately responsible for violent crime. Common sense would tell you that this is effective. I don't care what some BS "report" says.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059324)

This isn't true at all.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059329)

This is a very small % of any population.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059347)

And just because it was wrong in your case doesn't mean it's not an effective tactic overall. That's ridiculous logic.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059376)

Black criminals now wear skinny jeans and ride skateboards because that's how black males in NYC dress. Is that thuggish now? In the 70's black criminal wore velvet suits. You're using ridiculous circular logic.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059406)

I gave you the limited parameter of who the cops profile. What is your counter profile? I highly doubt your response will encompass a large % of the population.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059442)

Using your standards for "thuggish" (ie what the typical urban black young male wears) then yea it does.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059464)

Who do you think commits violent crime? Thug pieces of shit.

They are easy to spot by identification. And they are NOT twink millennial black males wearing skinny jeans. They move with a "toughguy" swagger, and generally try to project an image of being dangerous.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059496)

Lol, I think we've found the real cuck ITT.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059501)

You are the one being deceptive, pretending that young pussy looking blacks (who obviously pose no violent crime threat) were getting harassed by the cops left and right.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059516)

Black males who live in cities tend to dress alike. Criminals from this population are no exception.

This is like saying biglawyers have a "white collar criminal" look about them. It's retarded.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059528)

You are wrong to suggest that violent criminals are indistinguishable from young pussy looking blacks while on the street. Any cop should be able to tell the difference. And the first group is who is targeted.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059575)

I call them pussy looking.

And I say you are pretending that these people are the ones being targeted by stop and frisk.

In fact, the ones who were targeted were the obvious looking ones, as I just described. It's just common sense.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059683)

Jesus H Christ you must be flaming.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059687)

This sort of attitude is part and parcel of the lib denial of reality. "Judging a book by its cove" is one of the cardinal sins in lib religion and is also the reason why wisconsin grandmas are searched by TSA at the airport.

In reality being able to make snap judgements about a person's intentions and behavior based on external cues is a valuable skill that humans have evolved to stay alive.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35060828)

obviously, you are correct and war machine is a twit

stop and frisk works because cops aren't idiots

the fact that crime still went down without it can be explained away easily and while it may be moving the goalposts, it's still common sense

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059680)

do tell.

And I've been posting her for over a decade genius.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059688)

1. environment safer so fewer need to carry

2. area no longer conducive to criminal activity

3. people arrested due to stop and frisk incarcerated, so a variant of 1

4. the crime moved to a different location due to stop and frisk and reached critical mass

5. gentrification occurred due to stop and frisk and then continued

etc

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059744)

But yes, you are correct. I think I'm just wasting my time explaining further at this point.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059695)

(XO 2018)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059613)

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/173419/view-harlem-michael-potemra

They have been THE cuck publication of record for decades.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059253)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059265)

both liberals and conservatives commit the same mistake by reducing everything to a single root cause. it feels great for their ego when they "solve" a major problem this way - black underachievement is entirely due to low average IQ or white racism depending on which side of the political divide you fall on

now coming back to stop and frisk it was very effective and the right thing to do when it was introduced in the 90s by Giuliani. The simple fact is that new york today is not the same as new york in the 90s. less edgy, more gentrified, major changes in socioeconomic scenarios etc etc. So there is no universal correct answer on stop and frisk and its effectiveness varies on a case to case basis. An aggressive stop and frisk system in Chicago or Baltimore would be one of the best things we can do to curb crime in those cities. In fact the sharp increase in violent crime in those cities post michael brown is almost entirely due to police pulling back from the quasi stop and frisk tactics that they used in those cities

tl;dr - people who use NYC 2018 to condemn stop and frisk as ineffective and irrelevant are misguided and missing the point

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059301)

As I've pointed out in other threads, there aren't bad neighborhoods in NYC, only bad blocks. Those bad blocks remain but have seen absurd drops in violent crime.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059325)

Cops still stop and questions people they suspect of criminal activity. This hasn't stopped in NYC.

The NYPD used to do blanketed sweeps of entire hoods in an attempt to meet quotas for people stopped and frisk.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059395)

now what NYPD was doing maybe too heavy handed and aggressive. I cant comment on that since I never lived in NYC or closely followed how they implemented stop and frisk

All i know is that I remember seeing pictures of Bronx from 70s/80s where it looked like bombed out somalia. Anybody who thinks aggressive policing in such neighborhoods wont matter is silly. Now look at Bronx (with million dollar homes) and its obvious why stop and frisk is not needed anymore at least as it was done in the 90s

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059536)

Increased patrols, promotion of the tips hotlines, placements of floodlights and cameras on high crime corners etc. absolutely help.

Draconian gun control enforcement helps too, but the conservatives here would NEVER admit to that.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059586)

he meant *without*. He was sarcastically commenting on the idea of cops finding illegal guns without using stop and frisk.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059785)

also, for a self-proclaimed small government conservative, you sure are a bootlicking piece of shit.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059795)

also, assuming i understand your criticism, both are voluntary security theater

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059844)

Why not just indiscriminately stop and frisk every single resident regardless of age, gender or location if all you care about is reducing crime by some negligible amount?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059796)

you start doing stop and frisk and people carrying are going to go to a different area. just because you don't get a ton of arrests doesn't change the fact that stop and frisk works

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059828)

Apparently they didn't have to use stop and frisk at all. Odd case.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059864)

war machine position: don't go to south side and stop and frisk people who look like thugs. no, let's spread out our enforcement teams to every neighborhood because it's more fair.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059967)

Another conservative myth. Crime started dropping under Dinkins, as it did in every major American city during the same time period:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/97/Giuliani_crime_rate.png

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059354)

also i did some basic googling and just like most issues under the sun there are conflicting studies. sociological research by nature is heavily dependent on how they are designed and people hellbent on coming up with a specific result can easily do so. look at police use of force against minorities. there are multiple studies including by a harvard black prof which show that race is not factor but Obama's DOJ/BLM have their own research showing otherwise

now again NYPD might have gone buckwild but this wikipedia chart is not useful regarding the effectiveness of stop and frisk

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059643)

of course it was effective.

that doesn't mean it was the right thing to do.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059810)

if the argument is that it wasn't necessary and alternative means were available then start being specific and explain why those alternatives weren't used in the first place?

manhattan was a shit hole, giuliani fixed it with stop and frisk and some other regulations. now it's not a shit hole

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059874)

It is the height of irresponsibility to ever give into the libs on anything in this environment. If the facts are not at your back, you need to make up alternative facts and not just capitulate to the other side.

The liberals will take the victory on stop and frisk and move on to disarming the police or revising use of force standards or whatever their next step is, and the march to total lib carnival will continue.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059403)

There are more police patrolling New York City than there were when De Blasio took office.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059433)

you need to repair your sarcasm detector

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059456)

De Blasio won in a landslide, and won re-election in a landslide. The same city that voted for Bloomberg 3 times.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059484)

JFC. why is everybody falling for this obvious troll job?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059469)

i rarely get mad on the internet but fuck this opinion. what a misery-enhancing worldview

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3846631&forum_id=2#35059865)