They cause lots of mayhem, but do lots of great stuff also.

Net positive, IMHO.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109377)

At the end of the say the White race is dying. Almost certainly would not have happened but for the jews.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109867)

I took a few philosophy courses. There's a reason you go from Greek philosophers to a series of Christian ones that build off of them, but you never get into say, the Talmud.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109383)

Greco/Roman culture is the other primary influence re: governance, democracy and secular law.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109392)

For a Jew, the most important thing is compliance with the laws of God as conveyed in the OT. In general, the story of the OT is Jews and THEIR history and why THEY are special. It is not intended to apply to or be read by anyone non-Jewish.

For a Christian, the laws of the OT mean nothing at all. The most important thing is faith in Jesus Christ and acceptance as Lord and Savior as described in the NT. In general, the story of the NT is the story of Jesus and how Jesus removed the yoke of original sin and how EVERYONE should accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109430)

From, of course, Catholic.com.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109485)

To put it another way, Christianity has more in common with the philosophies and traditions of Europe than Judaism. Example: our holidays. There is no overlap between Christian holidays and Jewish ones. Most Christian holidays are just modernized European pagan holidays.

What I don't get is why you're so wedded to this idea to begin with. Jews generally love the fact that they're so separate. That's a driving force of Jewish theology. Pretty much no Christians (except Jews for Jesus, who are an interesting subculture) believe this. So what gives?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109529)

Do Christians believe in the golden rule?

The main difference is your faith based belief that Jesus's claims about being the messiah are true, and that he rose from the dead and ascended to heaven, which in and of itself is not a moral or philosophical tenet, just a faith based belief.

/thread

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109587)

The golden rule is a bizarre point to make since that is Matthew 7:12, which is in the NT. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_7:12

That isn't the "main difference" - they are completely different in focus, message, audience, philosophy, etc. Your ONLY argument rests on the fact that Jesus came from the Jews and initially preached to them and the inclusion of the OT in the Bible. But the theological beliefs and philosophies aren't at all compatible. Seriously, it is clear you don't have any Christian education at all. Why are you trying to argue with me on this?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109653)

ljl

The Ethic of Reciprocity or the "Golden Rule" originated and is attributed to Hillel, a Jewish religious leader that lived far before Jesus Christ. What does it matter if it later appears repeated in some "new" testament clap trap? Of course it would be.

Just because Christians claim that the OT was "nullified" by the NT doesn't discount the majority of the spiritual, moral and philosophical basis of Christianity coming from Judaism. Without Judaism, there never is/would be Christianity. I sense this somehow makes you uncomfortable.

The mass adoption of Christianity was hastened by the adoption of Christianity as the official religion of the Roman Empire by the Roman leadership. That's why there are pagan ideas/holidays mixed in with Christianity.

If you claim to be a scholar of Christianity in any way, see if your school offers refunds.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109719)

First, while I agree that the Golden Rule is pretty universal, Christians care about it because it is in the NT and only because of that. Same reason we don't observe the Sabbath or generally require circumcision. As to the origin of the Golden Rule, it is actually Egyptian: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Rule#Ancient_Egypt

You see, many of the early religions borrowed concepts from one another. Now, I'll give Judaism credit for handing Christianity the concept of a single God, but I'll note that originally, Judaism wasn't monotheistic. That developed later.

I don't know what Christianity would look like if there wasn't Judaism. Jesus's entire schtick was a backlash to a broken Jewish society that focused too much on the rules of Judaism to the detriment of the human element and genuine theology (probably true of Orthodox Judaism today too). It isn't that it "makes me unconfortable" and I'm not sure why it would. It is just a little pie in the sky. It is like asking "well, what if the Egyptians never saved Moses and killed him instead? Where would the Jews have ended up?" There are a million "what if" questions we could ask of both religions. It isn't that they make me unconfortable, it is that you'll never get a satisfying answer because they're purely hypothetical.

As to the place of Christianity in the Roman Empire, that's central to the development of Christianity. The NT was written generations after the death of Jesus and the original apostles, so of course it was heavily influenced by the Greco-Roman societies that ultimately created it. You're ignoring how central that actually is to what Christianity is today.

Also, you're Jewish, we get it.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109825)

Ultimately, to deny that there would be no Christianity with no Judaism displays either a willfull ignorance, lack of knowledge or a the drive on an unspecific personal feeling, on the nature of which I do not care to speculate.

Either way, we've both made our points. If you're not trolling, you're intellectually disappointing.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109927)

You should probably learn about what the Trinity is before commenting. It is monotheistic. The father, son and holy ghost are not three different gods, but rather aspects of a single God.

I'm not sure I understand your point on Judaism. A) no one knows, but B) even so, Christianity 100% would not exist without European and Euro culture/philosophy. Honestly, a similar religion to Christianity could have started wholly within Europe and without relying on Judaism, even if it would have looked a bit differently.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110050)

And yes, Christianity is considered monotheistic, yet in Judaism any deviation from anything other than an absolutely singular, indivisible entity would be inconceivable, but I understand your point. Both religions were also highly influenced by Hellenistic culture obviously, not just Christianity.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110084)

I generally agree on your second point but theologically Jews spend much less time focused on the nature of God, just as they spend pretty much no time on concepts such as heaven and hell. The religion is fundamentally about rules and remaining separate and apart.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35112425)

bingo. it was a backlash to a bunch of legalistic schemers trying to cheat God.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110074)

actually he was concurrent with Jesus you fucking devious kike

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110069)

He died when Jesus was 10, goy trash.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110092)

B) ideas in that era spread slowly. In any event, it seems unlikely Jesus was directly influenced by Hillel (or, at least, this requires specific support).

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110325)

But I sense that you really shouldn't be debating Christian theology with me. Do you have any Christian theological education?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109541)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109712)

The "what if Judaism never existed" argument is silly and irrelevant. Without Europeans creating, promoting and adopting Christianity it would have died.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109860)

Debating with you is draining and strange.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109949)

re reform, i think you're soft-pedaling the differences here. a lot of orthodox Jews would consider reforms apikorsim and all orthodox Jews would consider a reform conversion invalid.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110043)

which one is "core" is a matter of opinion. a lot of Christian questions are simply unintelligible in Jewish terms, and vice versa. this becomes obvious when you attempt to analyze one in terms of the other.

for instance, it's actually not obvious in Judaism exactly what Christianity is. is it idolatry (avodah zara)? the Jewish concept of idolatry is based on semitic paganism, with its sacrifice, temple prostitutes, etc., and Christianity doesn't clearly map onto this framework. this is a live question because idolaters have to be fenced around in various ways -- you have to make sure that you don't inadvertently encourage them in their idolatry by (serious example) giving them discounts on a day sacred to their idol. as far as i'm aware, there is no definitive answer, only various opinions and prudential practices.

to go the other way, Christianity is extremely concerned about "hypostasis", a greek concept that can be translated a variety of ways, all the way from "person" to "substance". the question of whether God, as conceived of in Christianity, is a single hypostasis, multiple beings in multiple hypostases, or a single being in multiple hypostases, can't be answered in Judaism even in theory, not merely because Judaism takes as an axiom that God is one, but because the greek concepts of "material substance", "nous", "ousia", etc don't have equivalents in Jewish thought except to the extent that they are simply imported or translated from greek, thereby begging the question.

of course, you could look at all the above and say, "not core!" otoh there are major (and minor) churches that to this day reject union with one another primarily over the question of the hypostatic union. so clearly they think these issues are pretty "core".

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110035)

Unfortunately many Jews hitched their wagon to Marxism, recognizing its potential to destroy European society from within, which was a bad strategic move because of the needless collateral damage.

Now for many secular Jews their faith has been replaced by leftism. They define themselves in opposition to Western, historically Christian society.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110402)

1. People who just hate shitlibs and note that many Jews are shitlibs and fanning shitlibism.

2. People who are annoyed by "Israel is great and needs to be Jewish but everyone else needs to mix and accept whoever." Also annoyance as US funding/support of Israel.

3. People who are part or all Jewish that are annoyed by Jews. There's some overlap of this group with 1 and/or 2. This is probably the most awesomely XO group and the most interesting.

4. Neo-nazis that just want Jews dead. As noted below, apparently some overlap between group 3 and this one.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109250)

EDIT: original post amended to reflect this omission.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109347)

bolshevik holocaust was even moreso

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109264)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavon_Affair

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109368)

Dwi faggot

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35110331)

Look at politics, media, law, anywhere really. Is there a place in this country not made substantially worse by the presence of Jews?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35109892)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35145851)

*beady eyes bug out of skull*

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3852937&forum_id=2#35145880)