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Proof we’d honestly have been better with Obama third term (link)
Poast new message in this thread
Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:35 PM Author: Impertinent station codepig https://twitter.com/ubermensch11111/status/1153423069219889153?s=21 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573140) |
Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:36 PM Author: aqua double fault Wtf i love Soetoro now (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573143) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:49 PM Author: lilac concupiscible incel only for a moment (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573211) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 11:23 PM Author: aqua double fault Oddly similar to my feelings about bedmates (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573404) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:41 PM Author: Irradiated Very Tactful Corner https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tuy-xmNOvYM (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573169) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:42 PM Author: Plum hominid flame (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573171) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:46 PM Author: Boyish tank That looks like one year under Trump (about 250k per year) vs Obama's 8 years including the fact that people turned away at the border were considered deported under Obama. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573193) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:47 PM Author: Irradiated Very Tactful Corner Interior enforcement has also gone up under Trump and State Department figures show that legal entry visa issuances are down. That Twitter account is full of blackpill lies. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573202) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 11:22 PM Author: Mildly autistic wagecucks national security agency (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573400) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:03 AM Author: Startled personal credit line The definition for deportation hasn't changed. So the numbers can be compared fairly. Legal entry visa issuances are down but so are the applications for such visas. You could probably credit trump's rhetoric for scaring off some of those applicants (maybe trade tensions with china and india too) but I doubt that will last even if Trump wins again. 2018 saw a record number of naturalized citizens.
On whole, I don't think immigration in the aggregate has changed much, and there's a strong argument that a "third obama term" (or any dem) would have made it a lot easier for dems to go along with and improve enforcement. With Trump at the helm a big chunk of dem voters don't want anything to do with enforcement. |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:04 AM Author: Big henna ratface "The definition for deportation hasn't changed."
Link or it's safe to assume you're making shit up as usual. |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:07 AM Author: Provocative circlehead lay trumpmos turning against fox news now? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574601) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:42 AM Author: Irradiated Very Tactful Corner Didn't watch the first GOP debate or any of the other ones, did ya? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574811) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:48 PM Author: Impertinent station codepig Got a link (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573206) |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 10:50 PM Author: Boyish tank https://www.axios.com/immigration-ice-deportation-trump-obama-a72a0a44-540d-46bc-a671-cd65cf72f4b1.html
By the numbers: Under the Obama administration, total ICE deportations were above 385,000 each year in fiscal years 2009-2011, and hit a high of 409,849 in fiscal 2012. The numbers dropped to below 250,000 in fiscal years 2015 and 2016.
Under Trump, ICE deportations fell to 226,119 in fiscal 2017, then ticked up to over 250,000 in fiscal 2018 and hit a Trump administration high of 282,242 this fiscal year (as of June). |
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Date: July 22nd, 2019 11:26 PM Author: racy cuckold lodge Even for a yearly figure, it is lower than Obama's (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38573418) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 9:31 AM Author: Boyish tank There are many factors behind that though
Obama waving them in vs Trump making it harder
Obama calling people turned away AT the border a deportation
etc |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 9:40 AM Author: 180 bistre native Does Trump not call turning people away at the border a deportation? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574481) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 9:54 AM Author: Startled personal credit line Yeah, the trump admin hasn't changed the definition for purposes of the stats. So the data comparison with the Obama admin is fair. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574540) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 9:57 AM Author: 180 bistre native Got it.
GTTR, your thoughts on this? |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:11 AM Author: Boyish tank Link? Can't find confirmation either way. I'm not afraid to admit I'm wrong but I'd like to see that info confirmed. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574617) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:12 AM Author: 180 bistre native I can't find way. It wouldn't be very Trumpian to change a definition to deflate his stats, as he is usually lies about literally everything, but I can't find a link yet. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574620) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:12 AM Author: Boyish tank I suppose we'll call this one a draw then lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574623) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:22 AM Author: Startled personal credit line I posted proof below. I couldn't find an earlier report than FY 2014. Also agreed re Trump's use of stats. There is no situation in which the trump admin would call for a definition that decreases the number of deportations. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574685) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:31 AM Author: Boyish tank Right but see my reply. Seems like there's a change to definitions and what constitutes a removal btwn the two docs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574749) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 9:59 AM Author: Big henna ratface Oh look, it's LTM back to pull shit out of his ass! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574569) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 2:08 PM Author: racy cuckold lodge like you did here: http://xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308374&mc=16&forum_id=2
?? |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:04 AM Author: passionate stag film crotch Can we get a definitive link one way or the other here? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574589) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:05 AM Author: Big henna ratface Lol no it's LTM. This twerp walks around with a shit mustache all day. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574592) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:20 AM Author: Startled personal credit line The definitions are the same.
2018 ICE Report definition (page 10 of pdf)
"A removal is defined as the compulsory and confirmed movement of an inadmissible or deportable alien out of the United States based on such an order."
https://www.ice.gov/doclib/about/offices/ero/pdf/eroFY2018Report.pdf
FY 2014 ICE Report Definition (page 7 of pdf) "The compulsory and confirmed movement of an inadmissible or deportable alien out of the United States based on an order of removal."
https://www.ice.gov/doclib/about/offices/ero/pdf/2014-ice-immigration-removals.pdf |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:21 AM Author: passionate stag film crotch How was turning them away at the border ever a deportation then? There's no order and they're never in the United States. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574675) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:24 AM Author: Big henna ratface Exactly. Obama was doing this count even though it was improper. Posting a link to a definition that Obama failed to follow doesn't exactly support his argument. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574702) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:27 AM Author: Boyish tank From the 2014 document, same paragraph:
Removal: The compulsory and confirmed movement of an inadmissible or deportable alien out of the United States based on an order of removal. An individual who is removed may have administrative or criminal consequences placed on subsequent reentry because of the removal. ICE removals also include voluntary returns, voluntary departures, and withdrawals of admission for cases managed by ICE officers and agents.
So people who left on their own were counted as removals? Voluntary returns/departures? Is that the turning away at the border?
From 2018:
ICE Removals include removals and returns initiated by ICE and those initiated by other agencies in which aliens were turned over to ICE for repatriation efforts. Returns include Voluntary Returns, Voluntary Departures, and Withdrawals Under Docket Control. Any voluntary return recorded on or after June 1, 2013 without an ICE intake case is not recorded as an ICE removal.
2014 explicitly says returns and removals are the same:
Removal data is historical and remains static. Removals include Returns. Returns include Voluntary Returns, Voluntary Departures, and Withdrawals Under Docket Control. |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:39 AM Author: Big henna ratface LTM out of breath as he jogs away from thread (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574793) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:46 AM Author: Startled personal credit line From what I'm reading in both documents, both definitions include voluntary returns.
At the very least you will have to admit that differences in numbers are far from what you would have expected given the campaign rhetoric that so enthralled you. |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:48 AM Author: Big henna ratface You were just PWNED dumbass. Do you know the word voluntary means? That was a trick question ape. Now run away. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574843) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:53 AM Author: Boyish tank 2018 does not include voluntary returns if there was not an ICE intake case attached to it after June 2013. That seems significant.
And yes, the differences are far from what you would expect on both sides. We are here arguing that Obama inflated his numbers. The change in definition would potentially explain Trump's drop. He's also been hindered at every turn by Hawaiian judges.
HTFH. |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 11:05 AM Author: Startled personal credit line FY 2014 was from Oct 2013 to Oct 2014. So it appears that definition for the reports I linked is the same anyway (and removals were significantly higher for FY 2014 than FY 2018).
"Aliens processed for ER and not detained by ERO or VR after June 1st, 2013 and not detained by ICE are primarily processed by the U.S. Border Patrol. CBP should be contacted for those statistics."
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 11:09 AM Author: Boyish tank And before June 2013? Seems like there was a good sized drop after that change
https://thehill.com/sites/default/files/figure1_immigrationgraphic-01.png |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 11:31 AM Author: Startled personal credit line Removals pulled from each report.
FY 2014-2016 Obama avg /yr: 263,870.33
FY 2017-2018 Trump avg /yr: 226,119
https://www.ice.gov/statistics
Even assuming that the pre-2014 definition made a big difference (no evidence of that) Trump's numbers are, at best, somewhat close to Obama's. Even if we took only FY 2015-2016 and compared it to Trump, Trump's average is still lower.
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:53 AM Author: Smoky fortuitous meteor property (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574885) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:45 AM Author: passionate stag film crotch Ty for your scholarship.
LTM I'm open to the moderate's take on this, if you have a response. |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 9:57 AM Author: Big-titted talking private investor roast beef What people don’t realize is that Obama was actually more conservative and hardline than trump. He just isn’t autistic and so was able to pay libs lip service while ignoring them in his policy making. Not unlike how the man of the house often has to pay his wife lip service while making sure she doesn’t destroy the family with her birdbrained ideas. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574556) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 9:59 AM Author: Big henna ratface lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574566) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 11:06 AM Author: Plum hominid lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574977) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 1:10 PM Author: Big-titted talking private investor roast beef is that a "fma didn't know what i had til it was gone" lol or a "conservacuck pink pill" lol? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38575650) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:06 AM Author: Provocative circlehead lay if we apologize to Obama do you think he'd come back and be president again? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574596) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 2:27 PM Author: french chapel Obeezy, your style is just too obvious.
I didn't even realize you changed your "we" pumo moniker for the 3rd time in 2 days, but when I saw these poasts ITT and it sounded exactly like you, I checked and lo and behold, it was you:
http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=4186463&mc=40&forum_id=2#38539816 |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 2:42 PM Author: 180 bistre native I enjoy this a ton because you're actually wrong. But the confidence you show is 1800000 and really gives me a lot of amusement. Thanks man. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38576055) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:09 AM Author: Provocative circlehead lay https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/trump-has-not-built-a-single-mile-of-new-border-fence-after-30-months-in-office (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574609) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 10:23 AM Author: Smoky fortuitous meteor property (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574692) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 11:06 AM Author: Slap-happy Fat Ankles Cuck I guess I'm voting for kamala (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38574974) |
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Date: July 23rd, 2019 11:23 AM Author: Impertinent station codepig Someone needs to primary Trump just so he can explain this shit. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4308183&forum_id=2#38575079) |