Date: June 23rd, 2022 10:33 AM Author: Mind-boggling Juggernaut
The court holds that New York's "proper-cause" requirement to obtain a concealed-carry license violates the Constitution by preventing law-abiding citizens with ordinary self-defense needs from exercising their Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms in public for self-defense.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 10:33 AM Author: Mind-boggling Juggernaut
Thomas says in the intro that the court is holding "that the Second and Fourteenth Amendments protect an individual's right to carry a handgun for self-defense outside the home.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 10:37 AM Author: Electric hell
lol @ breyer citing uvalde etc
The dangers posed by firearms can take many forms.
Newspapers report mass shootings occurring at an entertainment district in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (3 dead
and 11 injured); an elementary school in Uvalde, Texas (21
dead); a supermarket in Buffalo, New York (10 dead and 3
injured); a series of spas in Atlanta, Georgia (8 dead); a busy
street in an entertainment district of Dayton, Ohio (9 dead
and 17 injured); a nightclub in Orlando, Florida (50 dead
and 53 injured); a church in Charleston, South Carolina (9
dead); a movie theater in Aurora, Colorado (12 dead and 50
injured); an elementary school in Newtown, Connecticut (26
dead); and many, many more. See, e.g., R. Todt, 3 Dead, 11
Wounded in Philadelphia Shooting on Busy Street, Washington Post, June 5, 2022; A. Hernández, J. Slater, D. Barrett, & S. Foster-Frau, At Least 19 Children, 2 Teachers
Killed at Texas Elementary School, Washington Post, May
25, 2022; A. Joly, J. Slater, D. Barrett, & A. Hernandez, 10
Killed in Racially Motivated Shooting at Buffalo Grocery
Store, Washington Post, May 14, 2022; C. McWhirter & V.
Bauerlein, Atlanta-Area Shootings at Spas Leave Eight
Dead, Wall Street Journal, Mar. 17, 2021; A. Hassan, Dayton Gunman Shot 26 People in 32 Seconds, Police Timeline
Reveals, N. Y. Times, Aug. 13, 2019; L. Alvarez & R. PérezPeña, Orlando Gunman Attacks Gay Nightclub, Leaving 50
Dead, N. Y. Times, June 12, 2016; J. Horowitz, N. Corasaniti, & A. Southall, Nine Killed in Shooting at Black Church
in Charleston, N. Y. Times, June 17, 2015; R. Lin, Gunman
Kills 12 at ‘Dark Knight Rises’ Screening in Colorado, L. A.
Times, July 20, 2012; J. Barron, Nation Reels After Gunman Massacres 20 Children at School in Connecticut, N. Y.
Times, Dec. 14, 2012. Since the start of this year alone
(2022), there have already been 277 reported mass shootings—an average of more than one per day. Gun Violence
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:07 PM Author: gunneratttt (gunneratttt)
what else could he write? alito was right in summing up his dissent: "guns are bad". there is no intellectually honest argument against may-issue under heller and mcdonald, so the dissent contains the only thing it possibly can. guns are bad.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 10:57 AM Author: mewling black site mood
"And how does the dissent account for the fact that one of the mass shootings near the top of its list took place in Buffalo? The New York law at issue in this case obviously did not stop that perpetrator."
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:41 AM Author: disgusting menage windowlicker
Actually, the thing that concerns me about that line is that it suffers precisely from the sort of black-and-white thinking that afflicts so many people in the alt-right. The point of the statistic was to show that mass shootings are a problem and the law in effect was an attempt to mitigate that problem. Mitigate. Mitigate. It's a problem that's hard to eliminate, but it can be mitigated, and the law was trying to do that very thing.
That little line was very disingenuous, poorly reasoned, infantile even, quite beneath someone like Alito, and I'd like to think it didn't come from Alito but from some clerk.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:10 PM Author: gunneratttt (gunneratttt)
the court's opinion discusses revolutionary era laws prohibiting publicly carrying guns for menacing and wicked purposes. and they are presumptively valid. how does prohibiting an ordinary, law abiding citizen from carrying a handgun in any way mitigate (mitigate. mitigate. MITIGATE.) a person unlawfully mowing down a bunch of people with an ar-15? a NY law that says you cannot carry a gun for the purpose of disrupting the peace or committing a crime would be valid.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:36 PM Author: Charismatic alpha chapel
very scholarly, but, in your nuanced dissection of the issues at hand, have you asked yourself that most noble of questions: where do we draw the line?
Date: June 23rd, 2022 2:15 PM Author: Haunting locale antidepressant drug
This is obviously true but also irrelevant because good faith argumentation was throw out the door long ago and the people who try to hold their side to a higher standard than the other are doing themselves a disservice by deluding themselves that this isn’t a war
Date: June 23rd, 2022 10:46 AM Author: spectacular white jap step-uncle's house
NY will pass laws banning it in public spaces — subway stations, parks, sidewalks, intersections, etc. Then it says that the law complies SCOTUS ruling since it doesn’t ban all private spaces
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:13 PM Author: gunneratttt (gunneratttt)
yes i'm sure libs will be in perfect compliance with this opinion and not create carve-outs that essentially make everywhere a carve-out.
you know they will. it's been 12 years since mcdonald and hawaii judges and legislatures openly violated it with this may carry nonsense. you know they are going to find a way to essentially ban carrying guns everywhere a thing and it'll take another decade for that to get challenged. and who knows what the court will look like then?
Date: June 23rd, 2022 10:46 AM Author: Electric hell
lol alito gives breyer a huge FUCK YOU as a send off:
Exhibit two is the dissent filed in Heller by JUSTICE
BREYER, the author of today’s dissent. At issue in Heller
was an ordinance that made it impossible for any District
of Columbia resident to keep a handgun in the home for
self-defense. See 554 U. S., at 574–575. Even the respondent, who carried a gun on the job while protecting federal
facilities, did not qualify. Id., at 575–576. The District of
Columbia law was an extreme outlier; only a few other jurisdictions in the entire country had similar laws. Nevertheless, JUSTICE BREYER’s dissent, while accepting for the
sake of argument that the Second Amendment protects the
right to keep a handgun in the home, concluded, based on
essentially the same test that today’s dissent defends, that
the District’s complete ban was constitutional. See id., at
689, 722 (under “an interest-balancing inquiry. . .” the dissent would “conclude that the District’s measure is a proportionate, not a disproportionate, response to the compelling concerns that led the District to adopt it”).
Like that dissent in Heller, the real thrust of today’s dissent is that guns are bad and that States and local jurisdictions should be free to restrict them essentially as they see
fit.3 That argument was rejected in Heller, and while the
dissent protests that it is not rearguing Heller, it proceeds
BU BU BUT where do we draw the line on postratification practice affecting the original meaning of the Constitution????
I join the Court’s opinion in full. I write separately to
highlight two methodological points that the Court does not
resolve. First, the Court does not conclusively determine
the manner and circumstances in which postratification
practice may bear on the original meaning of the Constitution. See ante, at 24–29. Scholars have proposed competing
and potentially conflicting frameworks for this analysis, including liquidation, tradition, and precedent. See, e.g., Nelson, Originalism and Interpretive Conventions, 70 U. Chi.
L. Rev. 519 (2003); McConnell, Time, Institutions, and Interpretation, 95 B. U. L. Rev. 1745 (2015). The limits on
the permissible use of history may vary between these
frameworks (and between different articulations of each
one). To name just a few unsettled questions: How long after ratification may subsequent practice illuminate original
public meaning? Cf. McCulloch v. Maryland, 4 Wheat. 316,
401 (1819) (citing practice “introduced at a very early period
of our history”). What form must practice take to carry
weight in constitutional analysis? See Myers v. United
States, 272 U. S. 52, 175 (1926) (citing a “legislative exposition of the Constitution . . . acquiesced in for a long term of
years”). And may practice settle the meaning of individual
rights as well as structural provisions? See Baude, Constitutional Liquidation, 71 Stan. L. Rev. 1, 49–51 (2019) (canvassing arguments). The historical inquiry presented in
this case does not require us to answer such questions,
which might make a difference in another case. See ante,
Date: June 23rd, 2022 10:57 AM Author: Electric hell
that's the bullshit of conlaw. takes 5 years to litigate this shit to the scotus, and u can just enact some other unconstitutional law and bide yourself another 5 years
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:17 AM Author: 180 hairless senate therapy
What is the recourse for states disregarding Supreme Court decisions? The Federal government would have to enforce the Supreme Court decisions, and we know that'll never happen under Libs' watch, right?
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:18 AM Author: Electric hell
harmed individual plaintiffs can sue the state in fed court for violating their constitutional rights. it'll just take 5 yrs for this shit to get litigated, and the supreme court might not even take the case
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:35 AM Author: Lime Lascivious Weed Whacker Property
cr.
CA law is weird: if you have a CCL from your county of residence you can CC anywhere in CA. so (not to be a Doobs) are you near Sacto, Solano, or San Joaquin?
Date: June 24th, 2022 4:48 PM Author: Bisexual school cafeteria travel guidebook
it's like this in new york as well.
people from rural counties in NY are given full carry permits in less than a week and can carry their firearm without restriction in nassau, suffolk, westchester counties.
people in said downstate counties need to wait 2+ years, provide multiple notarized good character references, pay a shitload of money, etc just to get a bullshit "sportsman" permit with significant restrictions on it. break the nonsense rules or piss off a cop? they'll cancel your permit, take all of your legally owned guns (including long guns), and you'll never be able to own a firearm again.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:22 AM Author: Electric hell
it just means that CA can't require a special need beyond self-defense for a CCW. who knows what other bullshit law CA can come up with to deny ppl CCWs
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:27 AM Author: 180 hairless senate therapy
Awesome. So I can just apply saying I want to concealed carry for self defense and I don't need to justify it in any way, right? Currently they don't allow concealed carry in my county unless you have an extreme justification.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:24 AM Author: Electric hell
the prob is they delegated their power to some 27 yr old snarky shitlib millennial clerks who write and think no differently than 27 yr old snarky shitlib millennial blue checkmarks on twitter
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:28 AM Author: Rambunctious organic girlfriend
Why was this ever a fucking issue?
“… The Sec- ond Amendment “is the very product of an interest balancing by the people,” and it “surely elevates above all other interests the right of law-abiding, responsible citizens to use arms” for self-defense. Heller, 554 U. S., at 635. Pp. 15–17.”
That’s it.
Fuck your Uvalde, Buffalo, Columbine points.
It’s all subsumed under the “law of the land”.
Amend the constitution if you want it changed. Fucking niggers.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:36 AM Author: Rambunctious organic girlfriend
All these common sense truth bombs is making me hard.
Making me want to go YLS OR HLS and “LIVE A LIFE OF THE MIND”
That said, respondents’ attempt to characterize New York’s proper-cause require- ment as a “sensitive-place” law lacks merit because there is no histor- ical basis for New York to effectively declare the island of Manhattan a “sensitive place” simply because it is crowded and protected gener- ally by the New York City Police Department. Pp. 17–22
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:40 AM Author: Electric hell
cr, it is awesome that hero CT fucking GETS IT despite this country treating his ancestors like crap. 180 that this great american can look past shit that happened 170 years ago and do the right thing.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 11:59 AM Author: Rambunctious organic girlfriend
No big deal.
Amend the constitution. See if you can get these faggotry post modern ideals passed. Should be easy to, after all they lead to prosperity and happiness.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:18 PM Author: gunneratttt (gunneratttt)
great point spaceporn. quick question though: did the court only consider 1789 laws, or did it considered reconstruction laws as well? since the 14th amendment is the method the bill of rights is incorporated onto the states. also, was there amendments to the constitution during reconstruction that would make the author of this opinion a legal person?
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:24 PM Author: gunneratttt (gunneratttt)
it's such a retarded lib argument.
"heh, well actually you weren't even a person in 1789"
[ignores the fact that the constitution was subsequently amended to grant black people legal personhood]
[ignores the fact that there have been no amendments to the constitution altering gun rights]
[ignores the fact that this argument is inherently racist, so because thomas may not have had the same rights as whites in 1789 that means that he isn't qualified to decide this issue? or that it's somehow contradictory for him to interpret history accurately?]
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:32 PM Author: gunneratttt (gunneratttt)
the law should be interpreted as written, and what is was understood to mean when it was written. laws can be changed or amended. in 1789 a black person could be enslaved, but because of the reconstruction amendments those law changed. the people decided through democracy.
there has been no change to the constitution regarding the right to bear arms since 1789. thus, the law should be interpreted based on what people understood it to mean when it was written. if the people want to change the law, the proper way to do so is via democracy, not by relying on unelected judges to make it up.
not so difficult to understand, but i'm sure you'll strawman the heck out of it, good buddy. the sad thing is that i believe you're smart enough to understand this but are just being intellectually dishonest.
We apply 1789 versions of laws passed in 1789 unless there was a subsequent amendment, in which case we look to the meaning of the the latest relevant amendment at the time it was passed. Originalism doesn't arbitrarily focus on 1789. It uses 1789 for the bill of rights, because that's when they were passed. It uses 1868 for the 14th amendment because that's when the 14th amendment was passed.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:24 PM Author: multi-colored temple
if we can have a conversation about whether or not guns are legal or abortion is legal or gay sex is legal based on what the law was in 1789 then by the same principle we should have a conversation about whether the jurist who stubbornly insists on doing so is properly seated based on what the law was in 1789
plus, y'know, his wife would have been hanged in 1789 for sedition (not that he could have married her anyway)
also, tricky how under this ruling there was no big deal about the glowie taking a nighttime stroll through kav's neighborhood with a handgun
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:29 PM Author: gunneratttt (gunneratttt)
do you really not understand the theory behind originalism or are you purposefully misinterpreting it to suit your argument? thomas lays it out succinctly in his opinion.
scalia, thomas, et al. have repeatedly, repeatedly emphasized that the purpose of originalism isn't in deference to the wisdom of those that crafted the law. it's that the only sensible way to interpret the law is to judge what people understood the law to mean when it was written. if the law is bad, it's the legislature's job to change it. not the court's.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 12:51 PM Author: Umber stirring base
To be fair,
Good. The sooner we completely do away with the fiction that we have "rule of law" in this country and normies realize what's really going on (power is power and all that matters is grabbing and holding onto power by any means because otherwise your enemies will grab it and use it against you), the better. LFG.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 1:38 PM Author: Harsh Ultramarine Pit
My hope is that if we can keep going that states like CA and NY/MA start splitting off from the Union. Then we can get enough votes to really close the borders, deport illegals, etc.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 1:41 PM Author: Brindle queen of the night old irish cottage
The Roberts/Kavanagh concurrence is the only meaningful thing worth reading. I found it to be a pretty reasonable position. It effectively controls when you add the 3 liberal votes to it.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 4:25 PM Author: Cracking principal's office
Concurrence: "Our holding decides nothing about who may lawfully possess a firearm or the requirements that must be met to buy a gun. Nor does it decide anything about the kinds of weapons that people may possess. Nor have we disturbed anything that we said in Heller or McDonald v. Chicago, 561 U. S. 742 (2010), about restrictions that may be imposed on the possession or carrying of guns."
The 9th Circuit is already measuring their trucks to see whether they'll fit through.
Date: June 23rd, 2022 6:36 PM Author: Cracking principal's office
Opinion: "Although its meaning is fixed according to the understandings of those who ratified it, the Constitution can, and must, apply to circumstances beyond those the Founders specifically anticipated."
Subtle dig at original **public** meaning originalism?